The following transcript is intended to aid in your study. However, while we try to go through the transcript, our transcripts are primarily computer-generated and often contain errors. Please forgive the transcripts’ imperfections.
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Segment 1
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Okay, before we get started, you guys, I have some really exciting news. Actually, two exciting news is, is that, that's not even a real thing. But anyway, two things that I think are so fun. Okay. Number one, the Sunday on Monday, Stunning Journal is back. It's back you guys. And it's free. This is so fun. You can get the entire Sunday on Monday study journal for free.
Here's what you do. Go to ldsliving. com slash Sunday on Monday and find where we put all of our scripts and transcripts and all that fun stuff. And you will see a link for a journal and you can just download it and print it off any time. at your home. I did mine and I printed it off. You want to go for the double sided option when you print.
And then I took it to a local copy place and I had them bind it on the side for me. And it is awesome. So we're really excited. It's free for you. So thank you for listening. And we just wanted to give back. The second thing that I think is so awesome is this is our very first episode of season six.
Doctrine and Covenants, and it is available to anyone with the Deseret Bookshelf app. So for those of you that are faithful subscribers, you can have anyone you know and love download the Deseret Bookshelf app and they can listen to this episode as well. And we just want to encourage everybody to dig into the Doctrine and Covenants this year because it's going to be so good.
And I think you'll be very pleased with this first episode. Welcome to the sixth season and first episode of the Sunday on Monday study of the Doctrine and Covenants. We are so excited to study this amazing book of questions and answers filled with eternal truths. And one of those truths I just have to tell you is one that I have a very strong testimony of, and here's what it is.
God loves you. In fact, back on April 5th, 2020, our prophet President Russell M. Nelson introduced the Restoration Proclamation to the world, and it begins with a declaration of God's love for all of his children. This proclamation, it also contains many other truths, and I have invited five of my friends, who are church history scholars, to help us dig into this amazing proclamation and learn about the eternal truths that it contains.
Welcome to the Sunday on Monday study group, a desert bookshelf plus original brought to you by LDS living, where we take the come follow me lesson for the week and we really dig into the scriptures together. I'm your host, Tammy Uzelac Hall. Now, if you're new to our study group, follow the link in our description and it's going to explain how you can best use this podcast to enhance your come follow me study.
Just like Cammie Gibbons, who I met at the most darling antique store, La Petite Maison. Oh, Cammie, thank you so much for saying hi to me. Now, one of my favorite things about this study group is each week we're joined by two of my friends and it's a little bit different each week and this week it is totally different because as I said at the beginning, I have five friends who I've asked to help me and I'm going to introduce them throughout the duration of this entire episode, so I'm not going to say their names now.
But I think you're going to want to be their friends when this is over because they're so awesome. You can actually find pictures and bios of my friends in our show notes, which are found at ldsliving. com slash Sunday on Monday. So everyone grab your scriptures and print off a copy of the restoration proclamation.
And we are going to dig into all of these things together. Okay. You guys, I am so excited that we get to begin this entire episode with my friend, doctor and professor Jenet Erickson. And we met back in the spring because we got to speak at BYU women's conference together. We were speaking partners and I'm telling you right now, she did not disappoint.
Oh my gosh. She was so amazing and I just thought she has to be the first person to speak about our topic today. So I'm going to welcome her. Hello. Welcome Jenet. So good to be on with you, Tamara. Thank you. Yay. This is going to be fun because give everyone a little background. Tell us a little bit about yourself and what your degrees are in.
Yeah. Um, so my PhD is in family social science and, and that means that I just study family, family systems, family communication, all kinds of details of family life. And I have the privilege of teaching at BYU. Um, in religious education where I teach the eternal family class, which just focuses on the proclamation on the family.
Today we're going to talk about a different proclamation, another proclamation, but I love teaching about all the aspects of truth that we find in the proclamation on the family. Okay. So this is so perfect then because I feel like one of the truths. There are many in the proclamation on the restoration, but the very first truth we read about, I'm going to read the paragraph, paragraph number one, and here's what it says in the very beginning, we solemnly proclaim that God loves his Children in every nation of the world.
That's all I'm going to read. I'm not even going to go further because here's what I wanted to know from you. In your opinion, like, why do you think that the proclamation about the restoration would begin with a statement about God's love? [00:05:00] That's so interesting. So interesting. I think we have, when we look at Joseph's ministry, the whole story of the restoration is about the gathering of the eternal family.
It's all of our heavenly parents children having access. To power, to be restored into perfect oneness with them and with one another. And that the entire plan of salvation was given because we have heavenly parents who yearn to be in the fullest form of relationship with us forever. And so it just starts right out.
God loves his children. We are their little literal children. And the plan of salvation with this sacred work of restoration is perfect. grounded in their yearning and love for us as their children to become all that they are. What would you say to people who feel like they don't fit in the model or the guidelines of what Heavenly Father wants out of his children?
Like there might be people who are kind of marginalized around the fringes. What do you say to them who say like, well, I don't have a place in God's family. He doesn't really love me. Yeah, it's so powerful how the adversary is, I think, his most powerful. Influential, devastating influence is to say, you do not belong, you are outside, you are not part of, and it's such a powerful way of destroying our identity, which then once our identity is out of, It's order, you know, not grounded.
Then we're in a position to be influenced by other things once we know who we are, right? It's why President Nelson says the most important thing for us to know is who we are as a child of God. And when we know that, then we are less susceptible as Moses teaches us in the book of Moses. When he hears who he is, God appears and tells him, thou art my son.
And then when the adversary appears, He, he can see the difference. Who are you? And is able to discern light from darkness because of the truth about his identity. So you're exactly right. All of us will find ourselves outside the ideals that we are aspiring to. So I know when we teach the proclamation on the family, the very first thing is to say very beginning.
The proclamation says every single one of us belong to a perfect family. Every one of us have perfect heavenly parents. Every one of us have a place of absolute belonging in this family. And when we experience things that are not ideal in our own families, in our own lives, which we all do, that grounding recognition that this experience of opposition is really to bring us to the Redeemer who confirms that we are loved by a father and takes us home to our heavenly parents.
Um, that, that is why the unideal happens. It's to help lead us to a redeemer who will bring us back into all that we aspire to. So you are right. The adversary is all about telling us you don't belong. You're not part of, you're not perfectly loved. You've done too much that takes you away from that. And so right here, prophets of God solemnly proclaim, our father loves his children.
Every single one of us. I so appreciate what you said because you, and you just said it because it's what you teach and it's what you believe. But when you said it, it hit me in my heart and it was the idea. And this is how I. In my brain, how it worked is the world we live in and Satan just wants to pick us apart and put us into categories based on things that don't matter to God.
Because you said our identity is we are his children. We are children of God. And I thought back to my primary days and the first song I ever remember loving and learning was I am a child of God. Period. Full stop. That's where it ends. And if we can remember that, there is so much power in that, which is why we go back to this proclamation.
God loves his children in every nation of the world. That's the first thing that he wants us to know about this proclamation. And then I like how you gather, you tied it into the gathering, then this is all about gathering all of us back to the family of God. That was powerful. I'm so grateful you shared that.
So I have a follow up question for you then, Jenet. Yeah. How do you know that God loves you? Hmm. Yeah. Oh, um,
I think it's, you know, sometimes we'll wrestle when we have hard things happen. Has God forgotten me? Uh, am I loved? And, and it's just true. When we turn to him, we feel he's [00:10:00] real, he's there. He loves me. I have a beloved friend who was a meth addict for 20 years. And she describes that, that it is the transformative feeling.
Of God's divine love that turned her in an entirely different direction. And, and, I have felt the reality of that love that she describes. I know addicts will say the moment you turn, you run right into his chest. Soon as you're able to turn around. He isn't far away. He is right there. That's what I can say from my experience too.
Praying, asking forgiveness, seeking to know. And I remembered that it is a real power and a real feeling because he is a real being and really our father. So how could he forget us? How could he not be right there? Oh my gosh. I love that imagery. The moment we turn, we, we turn into his chest because the adversary wants you to think that the moment you turn, then you'll spend the rest of your life trying to find him.
Yes. And that just isn't true. He's right there. Oh my gosh. Right there. Wow. That was so powerful. Thank you for sharing that. Others who share it, right? Yeah. Tamara, this, you, I love that you pulled out this line because the whole story of the restoration. Is this becoming at one? The whole reason, even the scattering that can seem so confusing.
Why the scattering? And yet you see this loving father who allows the house of Israel to be scattered so that the Gentiles can play a sacred role in his work as well. And then the whole family becomes part of the great story of God's plan of love, of learning, growing, being restored. Ultimately redeemed, resurrected in families.
So it's just no wonder it starts with that line. No wonder. Wow. Well, thank you, friend. That was beautiful. I am so looking forward to discussing this entire proclamation then throughout the rest of this episode to hear what our other guests have to say about the importance of this document in our lives today.
So thanks for starting us off. So good to be with you. Thank you. Grateful for you. You too.
Segment 2
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I'm here with my friend, Janiece Johnson, who I just adore. And I've known Janiece for a very long time. And here's one of my favorite things about Janiece. She's just so smart. She's so smart. She's so educated and she has really good things to say. So of course I had to have her on this episode because I wanted to know her answer to this question.
Now here's, before I ask the question, I'm going to read paragraph two from this proclamation on the restoration. Here's what it says. Two hundred years ago, on a beautiful spring morning in 1820, young Joseph Smith, seeking to know which church to join, Went into the woods to pray near his home in upstate New York, USA.
He had questions regarding the salvation of his soul and trusted that God would direct him now really quick in paragraph three, the prophet read this in humility. We declare. That in answer to his prayer, so we have a question and an answer right here. So my question to Janiece is, I want to know, sis, how do you think that this proclamation helps people who have questions?
Thank you for having me on. I'm happy to be here because I love this question. I love the response we get in the first vision and the response that we get from the restoration as a whole. Um, I'm already Emotional, because I believe this so strongly, but that the first vision reveals to us something about the character of God, and that is that God is a God who speaks.
And God spoke anciently, and God spoke to Joseph Smith, and God speaks to us today. And that this is part of the character of God. That God is a God who speaks. And then if we jump to thinking about questions, questions are how we communicate with God. And they are essential if we want to develop, if God is a God who speaks and God is speaking in the present tense, then the way for us to develop our relationship with God is to ask questions.
And I think that culturally, sometimes we have had this idea [00:15:00] that if we have too many questions, then that is a signal that we don't have enough faith. And I do not believe that anything could be more antithetical to the truth that the Restoration brings, is that questions are essential. That, that, that is how we develop a relationship with God.
And this is one of those early steps for children, how he develops his relationship with God. He sees the father in the son and he, they speak to him, um, beginning. You know, inaugurating as the, as the proclamation says, this restitution of all things, but for me, the primary witness here is that God, it is in the character of God to speak.
God is not just sitting in the heavens watching from afar, hands off as what happened here in mortality, but God speaks to us. And if we want to develop a relationship, if my, my niece, my sweet niece, she is four going on 34, um, she is like just this most precocious and brilliant child and has so many questions.
And if I want a relationship with her, I don't ignore her questions. Oh, I love that. If I want a relationship, then I listen to her question, and I respond to her question. Now, some questions, you may not be ready for the answer, and it's going to take time for her to get a, a full answer. But, God wants us to have a relationship with him.
And the way to do that is to ask questions, like Joseph did. Um, the, that language of James 5, I mean, that relationship was initiated by scripture. Him developing a relationship with scripture and taking those promises in scripture seriously. If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, for God upbraid us not, he's not going to chastise us for asking the question, but he's going to respond to that question.
And if we want a relationship with God, then we have to ask questions that develops our relationship with God. We're going to get, and sometimes the answers are, hold on. Be patient. Sometimes it's, this is going to be rough. This is going to be hard, but all of those questions develop our relationship with God.
And if we want to continue to develop that relationship, we need to keep asking questions. You know, Janiece, I love so much that you brought up James chapter one, five. And then you said, sometimes it's hard because I feel like that's what in James chapter one, that is what verses two, three, and four teach us.
I mean, two says to count it all joy when you fall in divers temptations. I mean, that is when you go to God and you're asking why, why am I in this scenario? And then verse three, knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience. And there it is, like, it's so hard. Why? Why am I going through this?
And then you get into verse five. So if you lack wisdom, ask God, he will help you understand the answer to your why question. And I think that James one five, these glorious verses that initiated so such this important moments that initiated the restoration, it tells us about that revelation is a process.
Joseph talks about growing into revelation. And President Nelson has recently reemphasized that, that, that receiving revelation is, is a process. And we learn the process through this conversation with God. We need to ask those questions. We need to reach out to God. And then we need to listen to the response.
And maybe the response, I mean, I think about, Prayer is all about communication. If our prayers are just us with a laundry list of things we want God to do, and we're not doing any listening, we're not getting everything that we need from that communication with God. Oh, absolutely. We start to listen as much as we ask, but those, those questions are essential.
Some of those questions may come quickly. I think I'm still, how old am I? I'm 51. 51. And I'm still sometimes just [00:20:00] so surprised at how quickly God responds.
Sometimes I've been struggling with something on my own for a little while and haven't thought to ask God. And sometimes it's just that me asking and that response is opened up. Um, other times I've been asking for a long time and it's not coming. But all of those questions develop my relationship with God.
And sometimes I can feel the Lord say, just hold on. It's not coming yet. It's not you. It's not coming yet, but it will come. You And those answers in those moments are beautiful and over time, Joseph is going to become someone who walks and talks with God, but he needs to build that relationship just like all of us need to build that relationship with God.
And that happens through questions, through asking those questions. And. Waiting for a response and sometimes the questions are going to come in a way that we don't expect and sometimes they are going to, it's going to be a, just hold on, you can do this. Um, but having patience with, with the asking and the waiting and doing that in faith is a miraculous thing and it can open up this miraculous process of re receiving and learning how to receive revelation and learning how God speaks to us individually because it's not going to come to all of us the same way, right?
That's something we have to learn how God speaks to us. So I, the whole time you've been speaking, and I'm glad you just brought this up because I have one question for you then. Everything you said was perfect and brilliant. And I felt the spirit so strongly. So here's my only question. How does he speak to Janiece Johnson?
Um, one of the ways that he doesn't speak to Janiece Johnson is with a burning in the buzzer. Hmm. And for a long time, that was a hard thing for me because 98, 98. 6 percent of the talks that I heard over the pulpit in sacrament meeting talked about Doctrine and Covenants nine, and that that was the model for how we received revelation.
And I never felt anything that I would describe that way now, you know, maybe it's semantics then maybe I just. That, that description doesn't work for me, but later it talks about knowing that it is right. That works for me. Um, Joseph talks about feeling that, that inspiration coming from on high, um, feeling that light coming.
That totally works for me. Sometimes the Spirit makes me hyper, makes me feel like, gives me energy, and makes me feel like I need to do stuff. Sometimes the Spirit is just that comfort. Quite often, the Spirit works to me through phrases, very often phrases from Scripture, that kind of feel like I have a sticky note attached to my forehead, and that I need to remember this thing.
And I can see how this phrase Plays out in what's going on in my life. There are certain phrases that I have felt very deeply need to be themes for my life. But all of that is ways that the spirit communicates with me and the ways that God communicates with me. And sometimes I have to strain to hear it.
I know now that answers to big questions, there is a very specific pattern and it involves a lot of time for me. And but that same pattern has followed in multiple instances of big questions in my life. And I now know that. Now, I'm not sure that I've learned to not be frustrated by the time it takes.
I'm still trying to figure that out, but for sure, but I have learned this pattern that that for those big questions. The majority of the time, they're going to take a long time for me to be patient [00:25:00] and to learn that process. And I think we all need to learn what that pattern is for, for us. Absolutely. I think I felt a collective sigh or breath of fresh air when you said that you don't feel the burning in your bosom.
Uh, I, I related so much with that and you're right, it is a pattern and everybody has their own pattern. And when you learn that. Everything comes alive, Janiece. You have so perfectly and eloquently taught us about the importance of asking questions and getting answers. And I just, I so appreciate you taking the time and not only that, but paying the price to know the answer to the question I asked you originally.
And for those of you listening, you want to read what Janiece has written because this is super exciting. I'm just going to brag on Janiece for a minute. She has a book coming out and there is this series called themes from the doctrine and covenants. And I think it's so appropriate because the theme that Janiece was assigned to write about is revelation.
And so you can get this at Deseret book. You can get it on Amazon. It's through the Maxwell Institute at BYU. Anything else you want to say about it? Cause it's so exciting. Well, just as a little teaser, um, building on some of what we've talked about, I actually have a chapter that is called the tyranny of a beer burning bosom.
Perfect. And I'm talking about how there are multiple models of revelation. There's never just one way that God speaks to us. It's going to be so good. I can't wait to get my hands on it. So Janiece, thank you. Thanks for joining us today. I love you. Thanks for having me. Love you too.
Segment 3
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Oh my gosh. I'm so happy. I'm with my friend Kaylen Nelson. And Kaylen was on the podcast several years ago when we talked about the living Christ. I adore her. She is a seminary and institute teacher, and she's also now a professor. She's teaching down at BYU and loving it, thriving, loving it. So fun. It is so fun.
And I asked Kaylen to come on and talk to us because she teaches in the religion department. So of course I had to reach out to her when we, when I found out that we get to talk about this awesome proclamation for our very first episode. So Kaylen, I first wanted to start out with this question. In the entire proclamation, there are so many amazing things said, and I want to know what specifically stood out to you.
because there's something that stood out to me. I'll go first. Can I go first? Sure. Yeah. I love the part where it says, we testify that those who prayerfully study the message of the restoration and act in faith will be blessed to gain their own witness of its divinity. Now, the reason why this stood out to me is I just got done studying the word faith in Hebrew, which Is so powerful because it goes back to the story of Moses when Amalek comes to fight the children of Israel and Moses says, if I go on top of the mountain and I hold my staff in the air will win.
But if the staff falls, we'll lose. And he realizes it's really hard to hold his staff in the air. So, uh, So two men by the name of Aaron and her come up and hold the arms up in the air. And if you read that verse of scripture, it says that the men supported or stayed the arms of the prophet in the air.
But then it says Moses's arms were then that Hebrew word is faithful until the going down of the sun. And what is so cool about that word faithful is oftentimes we say, I have faith in God When really the Hebrew version is, I will support God, like I will support the arm of Jehovah while we're going through this really crazy situation.
And we can't believe it's working, but it is, and we hope it continues to work. And then it says they prevailed until the going down of the sun, which is a euphemism for until the end of our lives. And so it made me question, like, am I an Aaron? Am I a her? Am I holding and supporting those arms? And when I look at this again, those who prayerfully study the message of the restoration and act in faith, like that, that story is truly where faith and works faith without works is dead.
If they had dropped the arms, everyone would have died and the fact that they were acting by holding up the arms. So I'm going into this going, am I really like this year? Maybe my goal is to really study the restoration and act on what that looks like. Act on the things the restoration has given us. All of this new truth, priesthood, ordinances, covenants, temples.
I think that's the action part. So that's my favorite part. I love it. What's yours? Um, I think the part that stood out to me this last reading as I was preparing for today Was it's the third paragraph, remembering that this is a proclamation to the world that this is not a message for members necessarily, though we're the ones to largely study it.
But [00:30:00] the audience is global, right? It's like this very, um, uh, somber, like declaration in the third paragraph in humility. We declare that God it. Mhm. And his son appeared to Joseph, and it's just like when you're introducing that concept to somebody who doesn't know it, like, sounds very bold to, to, to declare such a thing to members of the church.
We're like, yeah, that's the foundational, you know, concept. But I loved that, um, acknowledgement of, do we recognize how And Wild, but not, not a good word, but like how wild is this bold belief that we have and how outlandish might seem to those that we talk with and those who might not share similar beliefs, but nevertheless, with dignity, with humility, with solemnity, they declare that Jesus Christ and Heavenly Father really did appear to a young boy and that is the beginning of this.
And so I think that in humility, that like, um, precursor. Really just kind of caught my eye this time. Tell me about your experience with the first vision. When did you come to know that it truly happened? In humility, can you declare? For sure. And, but I, I wish, I wish I could pinpoint a time. I feel like for me, there are things for your testimony that Come more easily.
There are things that come more difficult than hard fought. And for me, a testimony of the restoration was not a hard fought battle. Really? But guess who was Jesus? Like how, how backwards? How backwards is that experience? Like, ask me to share my testimony of Jesus as an 18 year old, and I would have been like, Oh, but ask me to share a testimony of like the restoration of the church, the book of Mormon.
And I would have said for sure. And so for whatever reason now, again, hard fought battles, and now I feel comfortable. Um, but I would say because of what I went through to get my testimony of Jesus, that was more poignant. And for Joseph Smith, I mean, I've had questions about so many elements of church history, but shaken to the core or struggled to understand or had to have a moment about it.
Um, I really haven't. So I guess the moment. That's maybe cumulative, would be like my freshman year, I really, I finished the Book of Mormon in high school and, and prayed about it and didn't get an answer. And I panicked and I went to my dad and I was like, it's not true. You know, my little freshman heart.
And he was like, go to conference with this thought in mind and see if you get an answer. And that weekend was conference and Boyd K. Packer gave a talk. And he said, If you have prayed and not yet come to know you might be as the Lamanites who had a testimony and they knew it not. And my dad looked at me and I looked at my dad and he was like, you already know it's true.
And I was like, I do know it's true. I always kind of had, but I kind of wanted a moment like everybody else has, you know, that was kind of my ninth grade expectation. So I would say my testimony of the restoration roots back to that moment where I realized that for me, that one has always come easily and beautifully.
And it's. I've retestified and I've been to the sacred grove and I've, I've, I've felt it in solemnity, but always just kind of to my core. It's always rung true. Wow. Okay. So then let me ask you this because I think that is powerful what you just described because it is a spiritual gift, the gift to believe and to just go, Oh wait, I've always known.
Because that's how it is for me, Kaylen. I don't have a lot of a ha crazy moments. I just have these subtle, Oh, I believe. And I love that you recognize that. I think a lot of people think, Oh, because I haven't had these seminal crazy moments, right? Must not be true. So now we dive into this whole idea of the restoration and there are things that maybe you said you have wrestled with.
I want to know what, something specific that you did wrestle with, with the restoration and how did you come out of that?
It's not going to be anything new to anybody else, but plural marriage has never been a comfy topic. It's never been something I've thoroughly enjoyed. Like, and I think because there has been so much unknown around it. Right. In terms of, What was expected, what is expected of me, what will be expected of me in the future, that kind of timeline for me, that's where my issues with plural marriage have resided.
Um, and, and so as I've engaged with that wrestle, read some books, studied the gospel topics, essays, elder Ballard, ask us to know him like the back of our hand. Um, To an address to seminary teachers and and so I really just kind of dug in and that's not a very fun thing to dig into. [00:35:00] Um, there's not a lot of like warm fuzzies.
There's not a lot of like, but but just to to reconcile it for myself. Um, what do we know? What don't we know? And what is the expectation for me? And, and, uh, we were just studying fourth Nephi in my book of Mormon class. And we were looking at it and in verse 11, 12, 13, somewhere in there of fourth Nephi, it says that they were married and given in marriage.
And I talked to my students about, you know, in the prior verses, like the law of consecration, totally a given anytime we're in a Zion, like society, that is the law that has always lived, but like. They are married and given in marriage, but plural marriage is not a part of that, and that isn't the ideal, that isn't the expectation, um, Jacob too does a beautiful job, and so I think just understanding what God's law is, what his expectation is, and that he asks us to do difficult things, and, and for me, it's really just come around to this idea of God.
I am so grateful that many of my ancestors had the faith and the fortitude and the guts to do something that was so entirely contrary to their custom and time and comfortableness. Um, I am so grateful for their faith and I honor them in their sacrifice genuinely to my core. But I can also say based on everything I understand and based on.
Prophets and gospel topics essays that we don't know the nature of marriage in the next life. And, and as far as I understand, and as far as I've read, that's not something that's going to be expected of me or that I need to come to terms with, um, for myself to live it in a future day, like any of those things.
I'm like, I don't feel like I need to wrestle with that at all. And so, so do I make my students. Feel and understand that for sure because I want to lift that burden because it shouldn't be a burden. It shouldn't be something that we necessarily have to worry about. It's something that we should, like you said, faith and trust that we actively put it on God and we say, I trust you.
Yeah, I trust you entirely with this and I trust that you will make the best decision for men and women in this and I don't know. I don't know. What are you doing? Well, I'm dying right now because no, but Kaylen, you are a perfect example. You are Aaron. You are her because we know that Moses is the type of Christ and look at you.
You're supporting the arm of Jehovah by studying it out. Praying, doing all that you can with what knowledge and information we have. That is a perfect example of prayerfully studying the message of the restoration and acting in faith. That's what it looks like. And I think that's awesome because one of the things the prophet has said is we are living in the restoration.
Like it wasn't a one and done moment. So tell me this, how does living in the restoration give you hope?
Well, I think Doctrine and Covenants 130 is one of my favorites. It's something I use in all of my classes, but something especially I used in Living Prophets because when we're talking about Living Prophets and we're discussing the nature of ongoing revelation, um, but we're also talking about foundational truths.
I just love that. DNC 130, that we will bring the church forth out of obscurity and darkness, the only true and living church upon the face of the whole, the whole earth. And it's this concept of like, the church can totally be true, but it is also a thousand percent alive. And so I, the image for me. Is a tree, right?
Because how could the North Star be true and moving and living, right? And so the tree for me is way more accurate in its depiction of roots were grounded. We have foundational doctrines that we hold to that. I can have faith will never change. And then there are so many things that are branches for me that I'm waiting for leaves to grow or doctrines to be revealed or whatever.
I think it's doctor. I think it's article of faith number nine, right? And. will yet reveal many great and marvelous things. Like that, that is so foundational for my testimony. Because as a woman, I do think that there are a lot of things I don't know about who I am, why I am and where I will be and all of those things.
And so then I say, yeah, I am so grateful for a living church. I am so grateful to say, The canon is not closed, the revelation has not ended because I have far too many questions and far too many people that I love who struggle, um, with things that we don't understand. And so then I say, amen, hallelujah, a true living church.
And, and as you and I both know, even just in the careers of our teachings and whatever, in the last 15 years, the way we talk about priesthood has changed. Entirely in definitions have changed entirely and the priesthood still foundational and root, but our [00:40:00] understanding has grown significantly. And so to say, like, I believe it's true and living, and I can look back through my life experience and say, and I have watched.
The evolution. And so then I continue to have faith moving forward because I look back and say it's happening. And so then I know it will continue that temple endowments. Another beautiful example of that been so grateful. So grateful. So grateful for change. I know some people struggle with it, but maybe it's because I'm young or maybe it's because I'm whatever, but I'm just like, I, you know, I don't love changes in my personal life, but I love, I love, but I'll embrace any other change.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Don't make me change anything about myself. Just kidding. But you know, I think that's awesome. Well, I love that you said that it is true and 1000 percent living. That was powerful when you said that. It's one of my favorite parts about the doctrine of covenant section one also is that verse because you know, you get as a little kid, you get up and say, I know the church is true.
Because you've heard people say that, and you know that. But then to be able to say, I know the church is true and living, and that changes everything. Because then it allows for us to continue to grow and learn, and you exemplified that beautifully by the way you took something that didn't sit well with you, that was part of the restoration, and it has evolved and changed, and you challenged it with your faith.
And look where you are now. Still active. You still love God. I think that is so great. Still love God. Still fully committed. Fully committed. Because I have hope and faith. And that's what the restoration does for us. And I would say, hope and faith that isn't blind. Because I have seen. There is evidence.
It's not blind. It's not without, without precedent, right? I've seen, I've seen examples and so it makes it easier for me to continue to hold on. So good.
Segment 4
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Now, many of you listening know that when I choose guests, I don't really choose them because I go through my mind like who would be good, who would be good and, and names pop into my head. Heavenly Father is very clear on this is who it should be. Well, this was a unique experience because I had a little spot that was empty and I didn't know who it should be.
So how fun is this? I just Googled BYU professors. And this beautiful list of all these incredible teachers who teach at some type of BYU adjacent school pop up on this website. And I'm looking over all of them and I can't explain it, but just this name hit me and I thought, I'm going to reach out to him.
I Googled his name. I found an email address, his seminary email address, and just threw it out there. And he responded. And so I'm so excited to introduce you to Brandon Porter. Hello, Brandon. Hello, Tammy. Hey. Thanks for saying yes. Oh, you're so welcome. Thanks for the invitation. I'm grateful to get to be here.
Oh, yeah. So, okay, Brandon, for our listeners, tell us a little bit about yourself. Oh, my wife and I live in Kaysville, Utah. We have six wonderful children who keep life wonderfully fun and busy right now. We have been married for 20 years, I met down at BYU, and for the past 17 years, I've been working for seminaries and institutes of religion, most recently at the institute adjacent to the University of Utah, and also teaching one class adjunct for BYU and Provo.
Awesome. So that's why his name popped up. So I was like, Brandon Porter, I don't even know this guy, but he has a lot to share. And I'm very excited to talk with him about this incredible proclamation. So we are going to go in our proclamation to paragraph number eight. It's the second to last paragraph.
And here's what it says. We gladly declare that the promised restoration goes forward through continuing revelation. The earth will never again be the same and God will gather together in one all things in Christ. Now this paragraph is awesome because it talks about the restoration and in the come follow me manual, they actually use a quote from elder Uchtdorf and he says, sometimes we think of the restoration of the gospel as something that is complete already behind us.
In reality, the restoration is an ongoing process. We are living in it now. And this is awesome because we've talked about this before. The restoration isn't complete. We're living in the restoration. And so Brandon, here's what I want to know. Have you ever thought of yourself as part of the restoration?
Initially? Not really. Right. So when I first heard this statement from Eldert Ruchtdorf, I loved the meaning of it. And as it Was used more frequently Especially in the the language of [00:45:00] an ongoing restoration I thought oh, maybe this is a new way that we're referring to continuing revelation but then paying and paying more attention to The language that was being used, I realized, no, no, we believe in an ongoing restoration of the gospel.
And since then, I've learned a few things that have helped me make more sense of it, to be able to see myself as being a part of that ongoing restoration of the gospel. And it is, it's a wonderful, exciting thing to be a part of. Teach me what you've learned. So, one thing, Was being able to distinguish between the restoration of the gospel and the restoration of the church.
Sometimes, Elder Hallstrom noted this, that sometimes we use church and gospel interchangeably. But as he said, they're not the same. They are, Exquisitely interconnected and we need both and looking at the restoration proclamation we have the statement that We declared that the church of jesus christ of latter day saints organized on april 6th 1830 Is christ's new testament church restored?
And then we have these two other statements about God the father and his son jesus christ appeared to joseph and inaugurated the restitution of all things And the statement that you read about god gathering together in one all things in christ So in my study, I went to doctrine and covenants 27 verse 6 where the lord states Also with Elias, to whom I've committed the keys of bringing into pass the restoration of all things spoken by the mouth of all the holy prophets since the world began.
So, in looking at the restoration, and how could this be an ongoing restoration? Well, there is a restoration of all things. That pertain to the gospel of Jesus Christ and that would include the restoration of his church Which taking that language from the proclamation? That christ new testament church.
This is his church restored That's not to say we won't have continuing revelation that will help the organization adjust to be able to Help in the most efficient and effective way possible to accomplish the Lord's purposes within his gospel But that gospel is broader than Oh, that was powerful. I like how you just separated.
The church was restored on this date, but the restoration is much broader. It includes so like, here's my question. I wanted to know in your lifetime, is there something that stands out to you that's been restored that gives you sort of a testimony of something coming back or being restored that we didn't have when it, when the church was restored on that specific day?
Yes, this pertains to an element of the gospel of Jesus Christ that is ongoing in its restoration. So, a colleague helped me see that what Joseph Smith was doing was, yes, He was doing a work, uh, that would enable the Savior's New Testament church to be restored on the earth. Uh, it wasn't just about the church, and the church isn't just about being another Christian religion, but God was restoring, through Joseph Smith, Both New Testament and Old Testament elements things if we take the language used in the proclamation and section 27 verse 6 one of those things being especially that Abrahamic Covenant and part of our Covenant responsibility part of the things from the Old Testament that are being restored is Israel Yes, the gathering of israel.
And so One way where i've i've seen that in a personally compelling way and was super blessed to be a part of Is I was called to serve as a full time missionary in the russia. Yekaterinburg mission. Wow So when I opened that call, I couldn't pronounce where I was going other than Russia and was just super excited that I get to go serve the Lord in Russia.
Well, people older than me, when they find out where I was going would give a couple different reactions, but they tended to be fairly common. One was this genuine surprise and a statement of, Oh, I didn't even know we were in Russia. And I [00:50:00] thought, yeah, I guess so I get to go. And so I wasn't sure when that came about.
But as a missionary, I learned more and gained a lot more understanding of why it was a big deal that we had missionaries having the opportunity to serve the wonderful individuals in Russia and representing Jesus Christ to them. So there you've got this incredible group of scattered Israel who, as part of a restoration of all things, Need to be restored, uh, to a covenant identity and a covenant relationship with Jesus Christ.
Now, granted, maybe restored is, would it fit as well in that context where it's something that they haven't had, but it's something that the Lord did have Yeah. And promise to their fathers, mothers, it was restored because Christ fulfilled it. Yeah. And then we, we get it back. I mean, that is okay. I just have to tell you, Brandon, I just gained a testimony of something when you were speaking.
You taught me something that I didn't even know. This is so cool. When you said he was restoring Old Testament practices and New Testament practices, and then you brought up the gathering. And my mind immediately went to section 110 of the Doctrine and Covenants to verse 11. Because here in this, in this section of the Doctrine and Covenants, Joseph Smith is saying all of these priesthood holders who came back and restored gave, they gave Joseph certain keys.
And if Joseph was just trying to, if he was just trying to put a Christian religion on the map, he would never, this wouldn't make sense for him to say, because you go to section 110 verse 11, it says, after this vision closed, the heavens were again opened unto us and Moses appeared before us and committed unto us the keys of the gathering of Israel.
From the four parts of the earth and the leading of the 10 tribes from the land of the North, like he would not have known. I just don't think because why don't other, I'm trying to think of other Christian religions that say they have the key of the gathering of Israel. And so that was restored, but I don't even think Joseph knew what that meant at the time when he got it.
He just is getting this key to be for the gathering of Israel. And now here we are 2024. We have a prophet who has made it very, he's been very vocal about the fact that he has studied the gathering so much, and he speaks about it so often because we're living in that, that element of the restoration that is so cool, Brandon, thank you for teaching that to me.
Oh, thank you. I love the way that you you summarize that it is exciting to witness that and I love that you connect it back to section 110 So within the this context of the church elder christopherson has taught that the church Is the custodian? of the covenants of salvation and exaltation, the custodian of the Lord's temples, the protector and proclaimer of his truth, uh, and, uh, the, as he said, the repository of the Lord's authority in the earth.
And so the church becomes a means by which God's broader eternal covenant is being administered, being offered to all of God's children on both sides of the veil so that they can have that choice to come in to that covenant identity or covenant relationship and covenant identity with him that he sought to establish with his children from Adam.
Yes. Does he, in that quote, does he use the word custodian? He does. Why do you think he uses that word? That's a great question. Only because I was a custodian after school every day through ages 13 to 16. That was my afterschool job. And so in my mind, I immediately went to, Oh, I know what a custodian is, but before I give my, I want to know why you think he used custodian.
I like that. Part of the meaning for me is the entity that's entrusted. With the sacred stewardship that ultimately is answering to the key, the key holder that that being the Savior who's entrusted those keys to us. And gratefully, on earth, we have this mortal representative, his senior apostle, uh, in whom all keys that have been restored are entrusted he and I love.
I love how President Nelson sees himself as being answerable, accountable to the Lord. That this is the Church of Jesus Christ. And we have a sacred trust to ensure that that authority is respected and is administered in a way that aligns with what the Lord wants it to be, what his will is for that. And so a caretaker with a sacred stewardship, I guess, is how I'd sum up.
Part of the meaning of custodian, but I'd [00:55:00] love to hear more of what you're thinking. Oh, well, I'll just piggyback on what you said then. Cause my 13 year old brain is, and a custodian keeps things clean and keeps things in order and isn't, and is, that was my job. I was responsible for making sure everything looked good at the end of the day, and I had to make sure that it was clean and a place where people could come to the next morning.
and still learn that there were no distractions. And so then I apply that to the restoration and things being restored. And I think that's exactly what's happening. We're keeping it clean. We're keeping it like you said, a place where we can approach the Lord to keep the gospel of Jesus Christ, just protected and clean and in order.
Yeah. That's so fun. I love that meaning. It, it reminds me of something that was brought up recently in the context of discussing purity that maybe one meaning of pure. Is being in harmony with the lord's eternal purposes Oh, I like that. And so as a custodian of the covenant of the authority of the ordinances The church has a sacred responsibility to ensure that what the lord wants to have happen does happen In the way that he wants to happen and so we are Doing what we can To be aligned with the lord and keeping Those ordinances pure in harmony with their eternal purpose, and then same with the covenants, and then same with the authority.
Okay, and then just one more connection, Brandon. Custodians have keys, and they got a lot of them on their belt. Yes, they do. Isn't that so fun? I love that. And the head custodian holds all the keys. You, he'll occasionally give you a key to use when you need it, which he did, but I was never allowed to take the keys at the end of the day.
They were his. So that is fun. I love that connection with, with the key holder. This has been awesome. I have felt the spirit so strong as we've talked about these things, my mind. Like, I just, I love that. I just learned this from you. So cool. You're great. Thank you. I'm, I'm, I'm learning from you and the insights and connections that, that you make.
This is, this is awesome. Isn't it fun how you can do that on a random day? Just having a gospel discussion about doctrine. Yes. I love that. And bless you for taking the initiative to make this kind of opportunity happen. Oh, you bet. Well, Brandon, we might have to have you on again next year, a little bit longer rather than just a segment.
How do you feel about that? Uh, I would be honored for the opportunity at the opportunity done, consider it done. Well, Brandon, thank you for joining us. What a fun discussion. Thank you, Tammy.
Segment 5
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Okay. I am so excited because I'm here with my friend, Anthony Sweat, brother, Anthony Sweat, professor, Anthony Sweat, all of the good things. And we were laughing because Anthony, how long have we known each other? 26 years now. That's awesome. It's so fun to be back together. Oh my gosh. We were hired together to be seminary teachers back in the day in the trenches.
Right, right, right. When we both kicked off, it was awesome. You haven't aged a day and somehow my hair has gotten a little grayer. Well, you're a little grayer. I am too, but I color it. Let's be clear. If I let it go natural, I'd be all gray. So there you go. But when I was thinking about this discussion today and how I love that this week we get to focus solely on the restoration of the fullness of the gospel of Jesus Christ.
A bicentennial proclamation to the world. That's a mouthful. But this whole week we get to study that. And you were the first person that came to my mind. And honestly, I just can't think of a better person to teach us and help us end this episode. Here's what I want to know right out of the gates from you in 2020, when the prophet introduced this and read it to all of us, what were your thoughts?
You are a church history scholar. And so this had to have meant something to you. Tell me about that moment. Oh, yeah. I mean, the moment that he said, instead of, you know, erecting a monument, we're gonna, we've felt to do a proclamation. It made me think all the way back to the earlier proclamations.
Obviously, we know the proclamation on the family and, but I thought, hey, this goes all the way back to Nauvoo. In section 124 of the Doctrine and Covenants, I'll just read the verse, this is section 124, uh, verse 2. You are now called immediately to make a solemn proclamation of my gospel. And this proclamation shall be made to kings of the world, to the four corners thereof.
And so to me, just coming from a church history perspective, I see this as a continuation of things that, uh, prophets from the past have done. Uh, beginning in Joseph Smith's day. It's awesome to see it continuing in our day and proclaiming the gospel to the whole world. That was my immediate thought. Wow.
That is so cool. I had a friend who pointed out to me and she said, you know, when the proclamation on the family came out, it was like a no brainer. A lot of people were like, well, duh, why are we [01:00:00] even, why did the church have to do this? And now we're living in a time where it's so significant. And she said, I wonder what the proclamation in 2020 will be 20 or 30 years from now.
Because to us, we read it and we're like, well, duh. But there is so much meat in this proclamation, I cannot but wonder, what will people question? Yeah. Well, I don't know, but I just love that we have prophets, seers, and revelators who stand as witnesses of our Savior and His restored gospel, and they'll, they never vary from that.
They never have, they never will. And regardless of how the world responds, uh, we know how the, the Lord and his servants will respond. So I'm just grateful to have. Living prophets. Well, one of the things in the proclamation that seems so audacious maybe to anybody else outside of our faith belief system is when it says that the heavens are open.
I want to know what does that phrase mean to you? Really that's one of the powerful things about the restoration. We don't believe that God has ever stopped guiding his children, but this idea of a dispensation of the gospel in its fullness is going to be re given, reestablished with authority and ordinances.
And power and covenants and, uh, making people, uh, uh, reestablishing a covenant. People in the latter days and houses of the Lord and temples. Um, to me, when they say the heavens are open, that's what it's getting at. Um, more than anything, beginning with that beautiful revelation to Joseph Smith that they mentioned in the Restoration Proclamation in the Sacred Grove.
I think I'd want to be clear that God has always loved his children, always guided them, always speaks to them as they call upon him. Um, I don't think that's ever stopped in the history of the world. But what's unique in these latter days that this proclamation is declaring is the heavens are open in that covenant.
Priesthood, ordinance, authority, church, and then gathering all things in Christ in this last dispensation to prepare the world for the second coming. That's what's been burst open in these latter days. That's that's when they're saying the heavens are open. That's what I hear them saying. Yeah. I want to get personal for a minute with this question then, because I want to know, Anthony, what evidence have you seen of this maybe in your own life?
Well, broader. Obviously, I see evidence in the Book of Mormon, personally. The Book of Mormon is a divine witness that God did call Joseph. It's something tangible we hold in our hands. Being a teacher of the Doctrine and Covenants, I get to teach this record every day that we're getting ready to study this year with Come Follow Me.
And I know the voice of the Lord is in this text. The revelations of the Doctrine and Covenants are so powerful to me. And I hear the first person voice of the Lord. I see temples dotting the land, this gateway between heaven and earth, that the heavens are open. You know, it's not hard to look at human history and say, something has shifted in the last few hundred years.
Where we have this explosion of technology, um, science, art, medicine, transportation, communication, um, and on and on, you know, just wonders. Think of what's happened. That's either highly coincidental or God is just pouring out his spirit in these latter days. To bring about his purposes and even in our own lives, you and I have seen the wonders of the Lord, um, uh, in his carrying this work forward.
So on a kind of a macro scale, that's what I see to your question more personal. I mean, undoubtedly, I know that the heavens are opened in my, in my own personal life. The Lord has spoke to me. He's guided me from the moment that I've asked for his. His, his hand in my life, you know, leading me to serve a mission, to meeting my wife, Cindy, and getting married to my career path that, you know, something about, I just felt his hand in my life.
And then above all, I felt his hand guide me as a family man with our kids, leading our, our beautiful little, you know, as I call them, our, our sweaty ninos, my wife and I have seven kids and that's been the greatest work. And we felt the Lord guide us and direct us. Inspire our minds, our hearts. And I don't hesitate to use the word revelation.
He's given us revelation on things about what to do and how to do it, where to live. Um, you know, even, even more personally recently, I, I mentioned that I just finished serving a term as a bishop. And um, that was a sacred calling and just marvelous experience, but a challenging one. And I felt the Lord, the Lord really clearly let me know in a tender mercy, not in any prideful way, but probably because I was [01:05:00] prideful.
He let me know that calling was coming, you know, so clearly that I wrote it in my journal that I felt that that was going to happen. And a few months later it did. I could tell. A hundred personal stories like that that I just have a deep witness where it says we as his apostles invite all to know as we do that the heavens are open.
And I can testify with my whole soul that that is true out of my own personal experience and the things that the Holy Spirit has witnessed to me on a grand scale and on a personal scale. And I'm sure that there's countless others listening right now who can bear that same witness. It's just what a tender mercy of the Lord.
Guides us as his Children individually and as a people collectively. Wow, Anthony, thank you. You know, as you bore witness of that, I just feel like I need to second that witness because I can absolutely without a doubt in my mind witness that the heavens are open. And, and just experiences that you shared, I can just support and say what, what Anthony said is absolutely true.
And it comes in small ways, like thoughts that come into your head and impressions that you get. And I love it when the impressions match in my mind and in my heart. And that's the spirit that is revelation. And that is the heavens are open and they're open for all of us. And one of the things I know about you is that you're an incredible artist.
And it's your sort of creative outlet. And I'm just curious to know when you're painting or before you start painting, do the heavens become more open for you? Is that a, like an experience where the heavens are open before you paint a picture of the savior? Cause everyone listening, you need to check out Anthony's art.
It's amazing. And you have done an incredible job of portraying the savior. And then also church history pictures, which we love, but what's that like? Do the heavens open for you? Yeah, I'm a little hesitant to be like, you know, I just picked up my paintbrush and right I felt like I was just, you know taken away in a heavenly Trance as I painted a lot of painting is just hard work like and maybe that's something to say in this whole thing as we're Talking about elation we can all testify that God guides us But that doesn't mean that there aren't years of work and frustration and roadblocks in that path So maybe in a Rather than talking about an individual painting, I got my bachelor's degree in painting and drawing.
My original career plans were to be a full time studio artist, and I wanted to paint the gospel. I wanted to teach through my painting, and what was interesting is the Lord led me into classroom teaching, full time teaching, which I'm so grateful for. I don't know how well I would have done, you know, painting is kind of a solitary work, and I don't know if I would have done well as kind of a social person alone in my studio every single day, all day long, but.
My point is that I have all these journal entries of the stereotypical frustrated artist saying why did I feel prompted to get a degree in art and to develop this skill and get this training if it wasn't what I was going to do for my work. Oh, yeah. And, you know, then I became a seminary teacher, then I felt prompted to get a master's degree, then I felt led to get a PhD, then I felt led to be a professor to apply and I'm now here at BYU.
And in those, that decade plus is how long a time I just covered. I have dozens of journal entries where I keep saying, I don't know what I should do with my art. But I keep, I feel like I should keep, keep painting, keep practicing. So, late at night, early in the morning, squeeze in hours on a weekend. And finally, when I came to BYU, it's like the heavens opened in the direction that my art should go, where I realized I was in a unique situation being a professor of church history and doctrine and an artist.
There's not a lot of people in that combo. There's a lot of greater artists than I am, and there's a lot of greater scholars than I am, but I'm one of the few scholar artists. And I started to see a niche of, hey, there's a lot that hasn't been painted of underrepresented or non depicted scenes in our church's history and in our scripture.
That I know about and understand that I can depict and so in a roundabout way, that's where I felt the heavens guide me as an artist is, is in doing that work of painting important, but underrepresented scenes in church history and scripture kind of bring in my academic and artists. Um, training together.
Well, that was a perfect answer to how the heavens are open in your own personal life and how we can have it in our own lives. If it does require work. Absolutely. Yeah. And frustration and tears and prayers and questioning starts and stops and fits. And then every now and then breakthroughs [01:10:00] and clarity and that's That's probably the way a lot of people experience the heavens being opened.
In the moment, it feels like we're just taking a tiny step and maybe even stepping into the dark, but When we turn and look behind, we can see the Lord's hand guiding us through it all. Oh, I totally, I'm a thousand percent in agreement with everything that you just said. It is true. And by the way, everyone listening last year, we used Jenny Shampoo's art catalog on the Book of Mormon art catalog.
And we're so excited to announce that she has now included Doctrine and Covenants art. We're going to use it this year and we're going to see some of Anthony's incredible works of art. So make sure you guys go use that in all of your lessons. so much. BookofMormonArtCatalog. com, Doctrine and Covenants is there.
And I love how we're starting out our study of the Doctrine and Covenants by studying the restoration of the fullness of the gospel of Jesus Christ. This proclamation is teaching us so much about the nature of our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ and how much they love us. And because of that, the heavens are open for sure.
They for sure are. Amen. Thank you for that testimony. Well, thank you for yours. So thanks friend. That was a great discussion. You're welcome. So great to be with you.
Segment 6
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Wow. I hope you were as filled as I was because listening to that again, just, ah, I loved it. I love the spirit that I felt. And one of the things that I really appreciated is that. I could ask them anything and they were willing to answer a lot of those questions. They didn't, they weren't prepared for me to ask, and I just did.
And I think that's really interesting when we talk about this idea of asking, and we've been promoting that a little bit about this podcast, this idea of asking, and we've actually made it an acronym for our year, A S K because Joseph Smith was always seeking more knowledge and we can too. I am a firm believer of that.
The Doctrine and Covenants is a book of questions and answers. Joseph Smith had no idea what he was doing and the Lord trusted him to restore his gospel back onto the earth. And so as he was doing this, he just asked questions. He wasn't sure. Well, what about this? And what about that? And as we go to each section and we read the section heading and we study the history behind each section, we get to come to understand what it was that Joseph needed more knowledge on and then how the Lord taught him.
And it's the same for all of us. I think throughout my life, how many times I've needed more. more knowledge and I've gone to the Lord and I've gotten answers and sometimes I haven't and that's okay. It's one of my favorite ideas that I've been taught by a friend. His name is Matt and Matt Townsend taught me this wonderful, a concept of being able to shelf some things and it has stuck with me forever and here's the best way I can think of it.
I'm older, so many of you can probably appreciate this, but back in the day when you needed to go study a subject. You'd go to the library and you'd have to look up a book in a card catalog and you'd have to find a piece of paper and take it out and then walk over to the shelf because there are more computers and then you'd have to find the book on the shelf.
So if I wanted to know who had the highest batting average, I would have to go to the library, look up books in under baseball, get the card out of the card catalog, go find the book, read the book, or most likely look at the pictures because that's probably what I did. Okay. Let's be honest. I did that a lot.
And if I didn't find the answer as a kid, I can remember several times not finding answers to things and just kind of going, all right, I guess I don't know the answer. And then I just put the book back on the shelf. And I'd go live my life. And that idea of shelving things, I think that's where it comes from is there's so many things in my life that I've had to just shelve and that I've later found the answer to.
And that's what I love about the gospel of Jesus Christ is it's okay to shelf some things and go, huh. I don't know the answer, but it doesn't mean we won't forever. I believe eventually we get everything answered. In fact, we know that and we'll study that when we get to section 101 of the Doctrine and Covenants.
We will know everything. But until then, I'm going to shelf some things and Before I shelf it, though, I'm definitely going to ask. I will always be seeking more knowledge. Joseph did. I'm going to, our guests today gave such great examples of how they are always seeking more knowledge. They're asking, they're getting their prayers answered, and some of them are waiting and that's okay.
And so I encourage all of you this year, as you study the doctrine and covenants, to go To kind of think about what is it that you're asking? Are there some things that you've had to shelf? If you have, it's all right. And in the meantime, let's dig into the Doctrine and Covenants and let's find out [01:15:00] how Joseph was able to restore the Lord's church back on the earth and how grateful we all are to be living in the restoration.
I love it so much. So, here's what I want to know then. What did the Holy Ghost teach you? What did you learn as you listened to and studied this incredible proclamation? I want to know. I want you to go and join our Facebook or follow us on Instagram and share what you have learned. And you can even ask questions, which I try to answer throughout the week.
Then at the end of the week on a Saturday, we post a question that comes from this specific episode. So go and comment on the post that relates to this lesson and share your thoughts. You can get to both our Facebook and Instagram by going to the show notes for this episode at ldsliving. com slash Sunday on Monday.
And it's not a bad idea to go there anyway, because it's where we're going to have links to all the references and a transcript of this entire discussion. So go check it out. The Sunday on Monday study group is a desert bookshelf plus original brought to you by LDS living. It's written and hosted by me, Tammy Uzelac Hall.
And today our awesome study group participants were Jenet Erickson, Janiece Johnson, Kaylen Nelson, Brandon Porter, and Anthony Sweat. And you can find more information about my incredible friends at ldsliving. com slash Sunday on Monday. Our podcast is produced by Cole Wissinger and me. It is edited and mixed by Cole Wissinger and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom.
Thanks for being here. We'll see you next week. And please remember that God loves you and you are his favorite.