The following transcript is intended to aid in your study. However, while we try to go through the transcript, our transcripts are primarily computer-generated and often contain errors. Please forgive the transcripts’ imperfections.

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Tammy Uzelac Hall: [00:00:00] When John and Jude wrote their epistles or letters, they were writing to the saints who were being exposed to some pretty heavy and corrupt doctrine, which was leading many saints into apostasy. The teachers of this doctrine were questioning whether Jesus Christ had actually appeared in the flesh.

Well, John called these teachers Antichrists, which is so interesting because in Greek, That title means one who puts himself in the place of or the enemy of Messiah. Now think on that for just a minute. Isn't that exactly what antichrists are trying to do. They are presenting their beliefs in such a way that their standards and ideals are what will save you, when in reality, the only person who can save any of us is Jesus Christ.

Today as we study 1st, 2nd, 3rd John, and Jude, We get to see what these apostles had to say and how they individually chose to combat the teachings of the [00:01:00] antichrist. Welcome to the Sunday on Monday study group, a Deseret bookshelf plus original brought to you by LDS living, where we take the come follow me lesson for the week, and we really dig into the scriptures together.

I'm your host, Tammy use a lack hall. Now if you're new to our study group, we want to make sure you know how to use this podcast. So follow the link in our description and it's going to explain how you can best use this podcast. To enhance your come follow me study, just like my friend, Cody Lynn Beck.

Hello, Cody Lynn. Oh my gosh. Thank you so much for the fabulous colored pencils and delicious candy. And I use those colored pencils every time I study. She gave them to me at education week. I love you friend. Now, another awesome thing about our study group is each week we're joined by two of my friends, but sometimes just one.

And that is what we're doing this week. Today we have, Oh, this person I love. Kristen Walker Smith. Hello, lady!

Kristen Walker Smith: Hello, friend.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: How much do I love you? Oh, my gosh.

Kristen Walker Smith: I don't know. Keep singing about it, though.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Seriously, I was grinning all morning thinking, I get to talk to Kristen. Oh, that makes me so [00:02:00] happy. Well, Kristen, I just think this is going to be so fun.

And who better to talk about John, John, John, and Jude? Then with you, right? This is so fun. I hope so. The most random of all the books. Not many people even make it this far in the New Testament. They're like, Jude,

Kristen Walker Smith: Right. Isn't that just in a Beatles song? Like, what

Tammy Uzelac Hall: That's what we all thought.

Yeah. It's a good song. I love the Beatles. Um, okay. Kristen, just tell everybody a little bit about you so that they can know how fabulous you are and why I have you here.

Kristen Walker Smith: Well, the most fabulous thing about me is that I am your friend, but I live in Idaho and I've got my own podcast and book series called One Minute Scripture Study.

And it is for anyone who is super busy and needs to just pop into the scriptures for about a minute a day. Thank

Tammy Uzelac Hall: With their kids,

Kristen Walker Smith: which is what I love. With their kids, yeah, you can absolutely do it with kids.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay, but here's what I want you to do. Tell everybody about your new project you're working on that you're going to have come out next year.

Oh,

Kristen Walker Smith: I've got an awesome, awesome study guide that I am working on and a YouTube channel. [00:03:00] So the study guide is basically for kids and teens and it will walk them through the entire Book of Mormon, 365 days of content, carry them through the storyline, but also teach them how to dive into the scriptures in about a minute or two a day.

So it's going to be pretty awesome.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: It is going to be awesome. I'm so excited for you. What's the name of it? It's called Start Here. Okay. Start Here. And you can find that on YouTube. Oh, I'm so excited for you. Yeah. Yes. And you know your stuff. So I'm going to recommend that. I think it's great. Thank you. Oh, thank you.

Okay. Well, anybody who wants to know more about my guest, you can check out her bio in our show notes and a fun picture of her. So go to LDSliving. com slash Sunday on Monday to check that out. And we are going to start here with first and second and third John and Jude. So grab your scriptures, your scripture journal, something to mark your scriptures with.

And a pink marking pencil, or a pink marker. You're going to want that for today's discussion. And let's dig into these fabulous books. Okay, first off, we just got to find out and tell [00:04:00] everybody, who is this John that is writing these letters? Kristen, who's this John? This is John.

Kristen Walker Smith: Well, he never actually really identifies himself.

He doesn't give us the name, right? But we, we believe it is John, one of the original 12 apostles, because he says in John that he was an eyewitness of the resurrected savior. And that's true of John the

Tammy Uzelac Hall: apostle. So excellent. Yes. And here's some fun things about John. And also, he's still alive. And this kind of just blows everybody away.

In fact, if you want to look at John chapter 21, verses 20 through 23, let's just go there really quick.

Kristen Walker Smith: Which John are we talking about?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: There's a lot of them. We are talking about John the Apostle, and we want to go to the book of John. Just the plain old book of John St. John. Okay. St. John? Yes. John chapter 21 and verses 20 through 23.

Tell us a little bit about this, John. Kristen, will you read those three verses?

Kristen Walker Smith: Absolutely. So I'm in St. John 21, verses [00:05:00] 20 through 23.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yes. And this is after the savior has been resurrected. He appears to the apostles, he tells him to feed his sheep, and then we get this piece of information. Then

Kristen Walker Smith: Peter, turning about, seeth a disciple whom Jesus loved following, which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee?

Peter seeing him, saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? Follow thou me. Then went this saying abroad among the brethren. that that disciple should not die. Yet Jesus said not unto him he shall not die, but if I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to

Tammy Uzelac Hall: thee?

Okay, now we're going to cross reference to that, 3rd Nephi chapter 28 verse 6. It's going to give us a little more information about this, John. 3rd Nephi chapter 28 verse 6. Can you read that verse for us, Kristen?

Kristen Walker Smith: Absolutely. And he said unto them, Behold, I know your [00:06:00] thoughts, and ye have desired the thing which John my beloved, who was with me in my ministry, before that I was lifted up by the Jews, desired of me.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Now, that's Jesus speaking to the three Nephites who said, We don't want to die. We want to stay here until you come again. And so I love that Jesus is like, That's the same thing John asked for. But then, next to that verse of scripture in 3rd Nephi, just put Doctrine and Covenants 7. And section 7 is revelation given to Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery when they asked whether John, the beloved disciple, was still on the earth or if he had died.

And so section 7 is a translated version of a record made by a parchment of John that was hidden up later, and it just tells us that he's still on the earth today with the three Nephites. I think that's so cool! to think he's alive.

Kristen Walker Smith: Kate, that was also a super fun scripture hunt. I love that we just did that.

Oh, you're so cool.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Well, that's your thing. You're good at that. You're, you're so good at that. Okay. John is also the author of the book of Revelation, [00:07:00] which we're going to really dig into next month. Cannot wait to do that throughout all of December, but let's go to this fun little piece. And we already kind of read it a little bit, but we want to go to back to the book of chapter 13, verse 23.

Here's one more thing we want to read about this apostle. Verse 23 says, Now there was, leaning on Jesus bosom, one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved. So John kind of gives himself a nickname throughout the book of John, and he's known as? John the Beloved. Now I kind of have to laugh, like I giggle a little bit because nobody else called him that so everyone just says how John gave himself that name.

And I love that so much because I would have done the same. In fact, think of what your name would be because, Kristen, mine would be Tammy the Favorite. I know that would be it.

Kristen Walker Smith: Like everyone knows you're his favorite.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Totally, Tammy the Favorite. What would your name be?

Kristen Walker Smith: Oh my gosh. I have no idea. You didn't tell me to prepare this.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: I didn't. I just thought, I gotta ask.

Kristen Walker Smith: [00:08:00] Kristen the awesome. How about that? Can I be Kristen?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yes, that's fantastic. You're writing and Kristen the awesome said unto Jesus. Oh, for sure. I like it. Yes. So humble. Well, I think what I think is so awesome about this is that John, even in his name, whom the apostle love John, the beloved, he is.

It's all about love. Even his writings are about love. Let's jump into 1st John chapter 3 and we're going to just look at verses 1 and 2. So 1st John chapter 3 verses 1 and 2. I like how he uses this, his title in context to us, Kristen the awesome, Tammy the favorite. Here's what we have connected to John the beloved.

Kristen, will you read verses 1 and 2?

Kristen Walker Smith: Yeah. Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God? Therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. Beloved, now are we the [00:09:00] sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be. But we know that when he shall appear, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Thank you. Let's just highlight at the beginning of verse 2 where he calls us. Like, I think that's neat he gives us that title too, Beloved Sons and Daughters of God. Like, this is a lesson of love. In fact, if we were teaching this as seminary teachers, I am confident, Kristen, that we would have our, our classrooms would be decked out in hearts.

We would have cut out hearts of paper, we'd have them on the walls, we'd have them dangling from the ceiling, our door would have a huge heart on it, right? In fact, I sent a package to Kristen in preparation for this discussion. Kristen, open your package. What did I send you? Okay. Because I would also, I would also have this for all of my students to eat.

Kristen Walker Smith: It is delicious candy hearts, little gummy candy hearts that my kids have been begging to eat since they came. So now we get to, do we?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yes. Now you can open them and enjoy. Eat one. [00:10:00] Tell me, is it good? Are you? I know you're off sugar. Are you off sugar still? I, you know what, it's

Kristen Walker Smith: a little close to breakfast for me to be eating candy, but I can smell them for you.

Is that a thing?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Sure. Yeah. You're like people doing it all the time.

Kristen Walker Smith: This is why I love you. Oh, they smell good. Yeah. Yeah. Oh,

Tammy Uzelac Hall: they smell good. So I would have candy all over. I would just want my kids to just, it just be enmeshed in love and goodness because that is exactly what the message of John is. It is purely about love.

Now in my opener, and this was my favorite thing was when I was talking about how the saints are being misled by some heavy doctrine. I loved watching you nod your head like you knew about this. What were some of your thoughts? One of the things I learned is John, he most likely wrote this between AD 80 or AD 100 from Ephesus, and some church members were adopting beliefs from a group called Gnostics.

Yes. Which sounds kind of crazy. What did you find out about them? Kristen? Jump in.

Kristen Walker Smith: Oh, [00:11:00] just that they were, they were denying, uh, the gift of a physical body, basically that like the body is evil and they didn't even believe that God, like Jesus would come down into a body because bodies are so evil. And so it was all about the spirit and they were denying that gift.

That. God has given us of a physical body for this mortal existence. It was all about denying the body of any pleasures like candy hearts for breakfast. Thank you. And focusing totally on subjecting it and, and making the spirit stronger, which has a grain of truth in it, right? And that's how Satan gets us is the grains of truth.

But man, they took it too far.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Wow, they totally did. And I really appreciated one scholar wrote, they also taught that salvation came through special knowledge. rather than Jesus Christ. That struck me because I think of how many people today are trying to just teach us, Jesus isn't real, but what I know is, and it's their special knowledge that will give you salvation and not our savior, Jesus Christ.

So what [00:12:00] they're trying to do then in these letters is refute this teaching. And. I just think it's fantastic. Let's just go to John 1, the very first page right here. It says the first epistle general of John and take your pink marking pencil or marker and just draw hearts all over on this page. You're going to want to remember that the message of John, John, the beloved who calls us beloved.

His message is love. And in fact, if you turn back to John chapter three, verse 11, it's almost like this is the theme for what he's going to talk to us about. First John chapter three, verse 11 says, for this is the message. That you heard from the beginning that we should love one another. And so he's going to teach that to us and we get to discuss this today.

So John believes that in order to be a follower of the living Christ, it requires love, love of each other. And so in the next segment, we're going to find out one specific way that we can show [00:13:00] our love for God and Christ. We'll do that next.

Okay, Kristen, here we go. We are going to do rapid fire answers. So I'm just going to give you one question, and I want you just to rattle off as many answers as you can think of, like we're at a game show.

Kristen Walker Smith: Like multiple answers to one question?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yep, yep. It's just one question, just as many things that pop into your brain for this.

This is scary. Okay, here we go. It's totally like a game show. Okay, ready?

It's like therapy.

I know. I feel like I should have a card in front of me, and you're standing with a buzzer. Here we go. List as many ways as you can. That we show love for others.

Kristen Walker Smith: Go. Uh, smiling at them. Uh, doing something kind for them.

Buying them something when you don't have to because it's not their birthday but you think of them anyway. Um, giving them a pat on the back. Paying a compliment to them. Talking nicely about them when [00:14:00] they are not around. Talking nicely about them when they are around. Can I stop yet?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Wow, you're doing good.

Hold on. I, I can't even write that fast. Oh, I do love the buying something.

Kristen Walker Smith: That's like my love language. I'm like, just buy me a Reese's. That's all I need to know you love me.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: That's why I love you so much. It's my love language too. Oh, it is. Yay. If I see something that someone would love and it looks like them, I'll just buy it and be like, Oh, they would love this.

Oh, okay. Kristen, perfect, perfect answers. Now, for those of you listening, write down your answers as well. We list as many ways as you can think of that we can show our love for others, and we're going to add one more to this list. So let's turn to 1 John chapter three. Verse 16. Here we go. 1 John, chapter 3, verse 16.

Kristen, will you read that for us? Yep.

Kristen Walker Smith: Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay. Now. Hello. So. [00:15:00] You can add to that list, laying down your life. for the brethren or our brethren. Now, I think this is fabulous because if we cross reference that verse to John, just the book of St.

John, John chapter 13, verse 34, this is where the Savior says, a new commandment I give unto you that you love one another. And we've talked about this before, but it's pretty interesting because it was not in fact a new commandment. You guys, this commandment dates back to the book of Leviticus. Loving one another, loving your neighbor, is something that the Jews had always practiced.

So why would the Savior say, a new commandment I give unto you? It's because when he says, love one another, that word love is not just a familiar love, it's the Greek word agape, which means to lay down your life for someone. Oh. Isn't that great?

Kristen Walker Smith: That's used all throughout 1 John, too. I was looking at the Greek.

It's all over there.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Tell me about what you found.

Kristen Walker Smith: Oh, just, I was studying the original Greek of it, and I [00:16:00] kept looking for different definitions of love, but it was agape all the way through.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Agape, meaning to lay down your life. So when the Jews heard that, when the Savior said, a new commandment I give unto you, and they heard love one another, they were like, well, we've been loving people forever.

And Jesus was like, no, no, no, this is different. I want you to be able to lay down your life for someone. That's the level of love that I'm talking about. What? It's like John doubles down on this. So he does this in John, let's go to 1st John chapter 4 verse 21. He's going to double down on this. And this commandment have we from him that he who loveth God, love Agape, his brother also.

Now, come on. Is that easy or hard? So hard. Right? I mean, I, I laugh at myself because I say, listen, there's probably been people in my life I wouldn't throw a life preserver to. Okay. Now, seriously, I would. I would. But [00:17:00] there have been times where there are people like, I don't want to love this person right now.

Yeah. This is really hard. Right. Have you ever had that experience? Well, absolutely.

Kristen Walker Smith: That's actually one of the things I've really had to come to terms with is that I have got to get to the point where heaven will feel like heaven no matter who else is there. I've got, I've got to be willing to let other people get there.

Even if I don't like them, I have to want Jesus to wrap them up in his arms. And that's a hard thing for me.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: How do you do that though?

Kristen Walker Smith: Oh, working on it, girl, working on it. And it's not a lot of people. There are just a couple of people who've really hurt people I love. And I'm like, I never want to see them again, much less, you know, be exalted with them in the room.

That'll ruin it. Right. So it is a, it is a matter of just praying for God to let you let go and let his atonement work in the lives of absolutely everyone, even the people that you never want to see again.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Wow. I mean, just the root use of the word agape. For [00:18:00] me, I'm thinking this through. The use of the word agape would just imply that you would need a savior to help you love someone like that.

Yeah, absolutely. It's easy enough to do this for family and friends, for sure. I can agape for my children, my husband, but to agape for someone I've never met? Yeah. Is that what he's asking?

Kristen Walker Smith: There are literally no stipulations here. He just says his brother also, and we know everyone is our brother.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Wow.

Okay, let me ask you this then. Do you have anyone in your life who you feel agapes you? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah.

Kristen Walker Smith: Well, my husband, for sure, like, I hate it when he goes out of town because I'm like, I don't want him to die for me, but I know if a robber came in the house, he would like, he'd run out and he'd be like, rawr, you know, like I just feel so safe with him and I would love to give that feeling of safety to everyone.

I think that must be what it's like to be with Jesus. You feel agape, right? [00:19:00] You know he died for you.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Oh yeah, absolutely. I don't know. What about you? I like it. Yeah, for me for sure. Um, I, I mean, growing up as a kid, I felt like that from my dad. Like I think my dad just, I still think that my dad thinks I'm the greatest human being that ever lived.

And. He just he would die for me for sure, but I watched him almost die for my own siblings I remember one time I had a sister who was drowning in the pool We had a pool in our backyard and I watched my dad We my mom screamed my sister's name and he jumped over a fence and then jumped and it was above ground pool and this man He's not quick He jumped over a fence and then jumped over the pool and got in and saved her and I was like wow that That was awesome.

So I just, what parents won't do for their kids is a perfect example of agape. Yeah. Oh, that's cool. Yeah. So much love right here, but we're not done talking about love. Okay. So here's what we're going to do in the next [00:20:00] segment. Then John teaches us, you listed some really great ways that we can love our fellow men.

And in the next segment, John's going to teach us 10 specific ways that help us get started on agaping our fellow brethren. And we'll talk about that next.

Alright, let's just go straight to 1 John, chapter 5, verse 3. Kristen, will you please read that verse?

Kristen Walker Smith: Yep. 1 John 5, 3. For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments, and his commandments are not grievous.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay. Now, we're going to give you some cross references right here. Let's also put 2 John, chapter 1, verse 6.

We're going to include all these. 2 John, chapter 1, verse 6. And that says, And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment that as ye have heard from the beginning, ye [00:21:00] should walk in it. All right, here we go. This is love, that we walk after his commandments. Let's put another cross reference right there to verse 6.

We're going to put 3 John chapter 1 verse 11. And Kristen, will you read verse 11? Yes.

Kristen Walker Smith: Chapter 1 verse 11, Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God, but he that doeth evil hath not seen God.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay, and you're going to want to underline, he that doeth good is of God.

Now, doing good, keeping the commandments, all of these things, this is how we show God that we love him. So he wants us to agape our brothers and sisters. But how do we show that we love God? And this is how he wants us to start. If it's hard to love your brothers and sisters, start with loving him. And one of the best things that we can do, and he gives us 10 ways, these are 10 commandments.

Because it said to, to, if we love him, we're going to keep the commandments, which seems so overwhelming. Now, Kristen, [00:22:00] have you done the 10 commandments in five minutes? Do you know the 10 commandments in order? No. Do you want to learn them right now in five minutes? Yes. Even less than five. Okay. This is my favorite story because when I was in.

I was a brand new seminary teacher, and I had just learned this, the Ten Commandments in order, and I was in St. Louis, Missouri, walking down by the arch, and they had a lot of evangelical teenagers out for the summer, and they were passing out cards saying, You need to be saved. Here are the Ten Commandments.

And so they came up to me and they said, You look like you need to be saved. Take this card. These are the Ten Commandments. And I said, Oh, I totally know the Ten Commandments. And this kid looked at me, he's like, No, you don't. And I go, No, I really do. Go ahead, test me. Like, I was so excited to put this to, to this knowledge to use.

And he goes, he looks at the card and he goes, Okay, um, what's the fifth commandment? And I go, Honor thy father and mother. And he was like, Oh my gosh, you got it. And I said, give me another one. Give me another one. And he called out a number and I did it and he was shocked and I was like, I'm saved. Like you're such a scripture nerd.

I [00:23:00] love it. Such a scripture nerd. Okay. So here's what we're going to do. I'm going to say a number. We're going to do the 10 commandments with a mnemonic device. Now, some of you listening have done this with me. We did a Book of Mormon year, but this is our refresher course, the 10 commandments in order one through 10.

And so I want you to repeat after me. All right, Kristen, you can't write anything down. You're just going to focus on me and I love it because you and I got the ADD a little and so this really works. This works. Okay, here we go. One sun.

Kristen Walker Smith: One sun. Two shoe. Two

Tammy Uzelac Hall: shoe. I know, right? So weird. Three tree. Three tree.

Four door. Four door. Five hive. Five hive. Six sticks. Six sticks, seven heaven, seven

Kristen Walker Smith: heaven,

Tammy Uzelac Hall: eight gate, eight gate, nine line, nine line, and ten pen.

Kristen Walker Smith: Ten pen. This makes no sense. I hope you know

Tammy Uzelac Hall: that. Yeah. No sense at all. Okay. [00:24:00] Okay. We'll do my favorite one, which is six. Six sticks. So when I was in college, one of the last papers I ever wrote, I decided to live as a homeless woman.

And I stayed in the homeless shelter and was, it was just a 24 hour gig, but I hung out at a park all day and I watched two men chase each other around the park with sticks beating each other. And I thought one of them's going to die. Like I know it sounds so ridiculous. I'm like, where are the cops?

Someone's got to save this guy's life. And so six sticks thou shalt not kill. Oh my God. No, you'll remember that. I promise you'll remember that. Okay, here we go. One son. I want you to picture right now. A sun in the sky. And when the commandments were given, the Egyptians were very, their, their influence was.

It's huge among the Jews, and they had the sun god, the moon god, everything. And Heavenly Father comes and says, No, there is only one sun, S U N. No other gods before me. Only one God. No other gods before me. Two shoe. [00:25:00] Imagine, when Moses came down from the mountain with the Ten Commandments, what were all of the Israelites worshiping?

Uh, golden calf. Picture a golden calf, and on each hoof he has a Nike tennis shoe. And that commandment is, no engraving images. No engraving images. Okay. So picture the golden calf with shoes. I know it's weird, but you'll remember it. No engraving images. Okay. Three tree. When you cut a tree in half, you have those rings and those rings are like veins, right?

Of the tree. And you can count and see how old they are. Three tree count the veins. Thou shalt not take the Lord thy God's name in vain. No way. Okay. I love it. Four door. I know. Four door. When you walk into church on Sunday and you go to open the chapel door, someone has shot a bunch of holes all in that door and made it holy.

Four door. Keep the Sabbath day holy. Five hive. In a beehive. Who rules the roost in the beehive? Who's in charge? The queen bee. Thou shalt honor thy father and mother. [00:26:00] Six sticks. What's six, Kristen? Don't kill! Hey! Okay, seven heaven. Seven heaven is your home cannot be a heaven on earth if you're committing adultery.

There you go. Okay. Yeah. Okay, eight gate, picture a robber and he has a mask on and it's night and he's sneaking up to this gate and he's trying to pick the lock on the gate so he can break in and steal everything. Oh, okay. Eight gate, thou shalt not steal. Not steal, okay. Now, nine line is a little bit more tricky.

It's old school. I want you to picture two people on the telephone, and you've got the phone lines connected into the wall. Okay. I know for some of you younger people, you're like, phones have lines? They don't. They did. They did. They're talking. Two people are talking on the phone, and they are just talking and gossiping and spreading lies about other people, things they've heard, nine line, thou shalt not.

Liar. Or bear false witness. Oh, okay. Yeah, bear false witness. Okay. And ten pen. Picture the most beautiful gold pen you've ever seen. And it's worth a lot of money and it could get you out of a couple [00:27:00] of jams. But your best friend owns it and you want it so bad. Oh. Ten pen thou shalt not covet. Okay, here we go.

We're gonna go with one through ten. Oh my gosh, okay. One. Okay, you got this. One son.

Kristen Walker Smith: One god. Very good. Two shoe. No tree. Three tree. Uh, Veins. Um, Veins. Veins. Line. Ugh. Vein. Hold on. Vein. Oh, no, so not take the name of the Lord they got in vain.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay. Perfect. Everybody gets a little brain freeze right there.

You're right on par for this. Four door.

Kristen Walker Smith: Um, uh, keep the Sabbath day holy. Five hive. Uh, honor thy father and thy mother. Six sticks. Uh,

Tammy Uzelac Hall: don't kill. Seven heaven.

Kristen Walker Smith: Uh, don't commit adultery. Eight gate.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Uh, that's not steel. Nine line.

Kristen Walker Smith: Nine line, uh, don't bear false witness.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Ten pen. Don't covet. Oh my gosh! I got chills.[00:28:00]

You did it! You totally did it. Oh my gosh. That was amazing. Did you come up with that? Well, I've changed a couple of them, but I originally learned it from Susan Easton Black. clear back when I was going to BYU like 30 years ago. Yeah. And I haven't forgotten. You'll never forget these. Okay. Okay. Now that we know the 10 commandments in order, and then we go back and read these verses where the Lord's like, John's saying, listen, if you keep, if you want to show you love God, then keep us commandments.

We read that all the time. John is always saying that love me, keep my commandments. Now we know what the commandments are. Now, last year in the old Testament, we learned. The first five are about God. The last five are about mankind. And so if we can learn to really keep the first five and show God that we love him, then the last five are a little bit trickier.

Now let's do this. Let's go to first John chapter five and we're going to read verses one through three, but we're going to use the NIV version cause I like the way it reads. Go ahead and read it for us.

Kristen Walker Smith: Everyone who believes that [00:29:00] Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the Father loves His child as well.

This is how we know that we love the children of God, by loving God and carrying out His commandments. In fact, this is love for God, to keep His commands, and His commands are not burdensome.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Thank you. Perfection. So, Kristen, talk to me a little bit about the complexities of loving God and keeping His commandments, or loving mankind and keeping the commandments.

Kristen Walker Smith: I mean, I think we all know it's hard, but I love... I love that last part, um, where it's not burdensome. It's not, it's not grievous. If we really love God, I actually, I was looking that up, the original Greek, it's barous, and it means heavy in weight. And man, did that make me think of Matthew 11, 28 through 30, where Jesus is saying, he says, come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I shall give you rest.

Right? Like if we do this on our own, it is incredibly hard. [00:30:00] to love mankind. But if we yoke ourselves with Jesus Christ, if he's part of the equation, then man, do those burdens of commandments. They are not burdensome anymore, right? The, the commandments are not a cross. They are wings.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Oh, I like that. Hold on.

I'm going to write that next to that verse. The commandments are not burdensome. They are wings. Like they just, I've never considered that the commandments could lift us. Like, like I'm a visual person. So I'm imagining just flying and floating and being lighter because of the commandments. That's what you're telling me.

Absolutely. Wow. Is there one specific commandment of all the 10 that we just learned that like strikes your heart or one that you've struggled with? I don't know. Any, any thoughts about a commandment?

Kristen Walker Smith: I love to, um, obey the commandment to not bear false witness. And I take that as the way I, I keep that commandment is that everyone's name is safe with me.

And I learned at [00:31:00] a young age when I was in high school, I was desperate to fit in and I was on the soccer team. And I was just never cool. I mean, hard to believe, right? But I was never cool. I, you know, struggled with hygiene. Just didn't smell good. No one really liked me. But I was hanging out with my soccer friends one day and they all started gossiping about another girl on the soccer team and I joined right in.

I was like, Oh, okay. Yep. Got it. Got to fit in. And this one girl, not a member of the church, I don't know if she was even a Christian. She just said, guys, I don't think we should be talking about her this way. And I felt so ashamed of myself that I was the Christian girl in the group and I had not kept that girl's name safe.

And so I have, it has been a mission of mine that gossip comes up and I end it. Like it, it's so awkward. Honestly, this just happened a couple of weeks ago. It's so awkward to be the one who ends gossip, but I want everyone to know your name is safe in my home.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay. When you just said that. Kristen, my best friend in her house, she had an [00:32:00] archway and above the archway in vinyl lettering, it said, your name is safe in my home.

You just reminded me of that. Yes. And you knew that when you walked into her house, like, and for everybody listening, I just want you to know that Kristen isn't just saying this to say I have been a benefactor of her truly speaking kindness about people. I witnessed it. She did it for me in a group of over a hundred people.

I will never forget you for that moment where you pointed something out that I did in a meeting that was really important and it was the most unsuspecting moment of my life. And I know that I believe that with all my heart that you will always think good of me. So. She really does what she says she does.

I want to second witness that. So, yeah, that's awesome. That story, and it is hard. You're totally right. It is kind of uncomfortable to be the one that stops the gossip, but wow, I just think that's brilliant to know that people are safe with you. That is such a great thing to teach our kids today. [00:33:00] Wow, Kristen, thank you so much for sharing that.

And what better way to show that you love mankind. Making their name safe in your home. Yeah. Gosh, that's a good one. Thank you. Okay. Well, that was so much fun. And we learned the Ten Commandments. So think of one that you, think of one you actually really want to work on or one that you have a good experience with because I think, you know, what Kristen shared with us to not bear false witness about another person and making sure their name is safe in your home is.

Especially in the world we live in today. That's important. That's tan. That is huge. Huge. So thanks for sharing that. So if keeping the commandments is how our heavenly parents and Jesus Christ know that we love them, then how do we know that they love us? We're going to find that out in the next segment.

Okay, now everybody get your pink scripture marker out, or your pink pencil, [00:34:00] whatever you have, and a scripture journal or a piece of paper. And here's what I want you to do. On that piece of paper, I want you to draw a big old gigantic heart. And I want you to leave room inside that heart for some scripture references that we're going to give you right now.

So draw a big heart in pink. And maybe around the outside of the heart, you could write, I know Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ love me, because And then put dot, dot, dot, and we're going to put some scripture references inside that heart. So I'll give you a second. Go ahead and do that. I know heavenly father and Jesus Christ love me because dot, dot, dot.

And we're going to have a fun scripture chain. This is a love fest scripture chain, how we can know that we are loved by our heavenly parents and Jesus Christ. And as we read these scripture references. I want us, and Kristen and I are just going to go through and discuss these verses as they come up and talk about things that strike us.

I want you to consider maybe things that strike you about how you know they love you based on these verses of scripture. So [00:35:00] let's start out with 1 John chapter 2 verses 1 and 2. Here we go. And Kristen, will you read that for us? Sure.

Kristen Walker Smith: My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.

And he is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Why'd you focus on whole?

Kristen Walker Smith: Because it includes that person you just really don't like, and it includes the person who hurt your feelings really bad. It includes the people who sin against us, I guess, is what I love about it.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yeah, absolutely. You know, I had to look up the word propitiation, because I wanted to know exactly what that meant. And it says, when it says, and he is the propitiation for our sins, that word means an offering to oppose wrath. Like that was what? He is the offering to oppose the wrath of God for our sins.[00:36:00]

So that just kind of gave me new perspective for what the Savior does. That was huge.

Kristen Walker Smith: Kate, can I ask a question here though? Yeah. Because I, I think that sometimes we read scriptures like that and like, Oh, Jesus is our advocate. And we kind of think God is the bad guy.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Right? Oh, good call.

Kristen Walker Smith: Jesus loves us, but like the wrath of God is against us.

And so I'm curious, like, how do you, how do you take scriptures like that and still see a loving God?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Gosh, that's a great question. Okay, hear me out. Um, so God isn't the bad guy. You know, for me, I think of parents who have rules and expectations for their children. Now listen, for me growing up, pre Punishing your kids days.

I can remember a situation when I clearly broke a rule and I knew I was going to get spanked. In fact, I even remember stuffing my pants with tissues or books because I [00:37:00] thought I'm going to get it and it is going to hurt, but I didn't. You can imagine my shock when I did not get spanked and I was just given a real minor punishment.

I thought my parents would be the bad guys, because there was this wrath associated with breaking rules in my mind, and they just weren't the bad guys. And so, I kind of think it's the same for our heavenly parents, like, As a parent, I'm not a bad guy because I expect things of my kids and, you know, as I've been raising teenagers, I have come to recognize that they just, a lot of times they just need outside help other than, or more than what I or my husband can do.

And maybe that's Jesus for us. Just some outside help to give us perspective, to help us see things differently and then to advocate for us. So yeah, I don't think our heavenly parents are the bad guys. But Jesus is the helper, so that we can do what we've been commanded to do, or so he can take care of the things that we just weren't able to figure out, so that we can [00:38:00] feel their love and their compassion for us, so they do have expectations and they love us.

But God's not the bad guy.

Kristen Walker Smith: Maybe wrath, or when it talks about that, it's just justice. Like it's just, it's just justice. And I, I actually, I feel strongly about this, that this is a message we miss sometimes in the New Testament. Because Jesus says over and over, he says like, this is God's compassion I'm showing you basically.

Right. He's like, I only do the things I've seen my father do. And I think. Jesus's mission was to show us God. Right. And so I, I just always hope when we read about like Christ being our advocate with the father, that we don't see God as the bad guy. And Jesus is the good guy. Jesus is like, he's the humanification.

Is that a word?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: No, but I love it.

Kristen Walker Smith: Right. He is showing us God. And so I just always hope when we read stuff like this, that it's God doesn't become the bad guy because man, does he love our guts?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Absolutely. [00:39:00] I like that changing the word wrath to justice to oppose offering to appease wrath or offering to appease the justice that has to happen.

Ooh, that's good. Okay, let's read another one. Let's go to 1 John chapter 3 verse 5. We're just going to read three verses. in 1st John chapter 3. So we have verse 5. I'll read that. And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins, and in him is no sin. And then go to verse 16. Which we've read, but it says hereby perceive we the love of God because he laid down his life for us, and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

And then verse 22, and whatsoever we ask, we receive of him because we keep his commandments and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. Oh, how much do I love that verse 22. Wow. By keeping his commandments and that idea whatsoever we ask, we receive of him. But it's not like asking for a million dollars kind of a thing.

I think because we're keeping the commandments, we're in such a place that we know what we can [00:40:00] ask for and pray for. And for me, it's been many times, whatever it is your will, like, that's for me, the most humble, humbling prayer I've ever offered. Not my will, but thine, um, cause Heavenly Father knows what I want and I want to just rattle off a whole lot, right?

Yeah, I, I think because we keep his commandments, he's going to give us what we ask, but we know what to ask for.

Kristen Walker Smith: I think too, um, with that, I've, I've struggled with that cause I've, I've been on here before and mentioned my dad died when I was seven and man, did we pray for two years for my dad to be healed?

And we were asking good things and we were keeping the commandments. And I think often maybe it isn't. that God gives us exactly what we ask, but he gives us exactly what we need. And what I needed wasn't for my dad to live. Apparently that's, that was God's decision. But man, did he give me good people to fill the gap of, of what was left behind.

And so [00:41:00] it's not always exactly the checklist you give God that he returns back and it's all fulfilled. Um, But he gives you the things that weren't on the list that you actually needed.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: You know, I really am thankful that you just said that because it took me back to a couple of episodes ago, we had a guest that said, not every trial is a blessing, but there are blessings in every trial.

And you just said that, like, it was hard what you went through and God gave you everything you needed. little blessings to get you through the trial. Absolutely. Wow. Thank you. Okay. Let's go to this next reference then about ways that God loves us. Go to first John chapter four and now listen, okay, this is the chapter of love.

You're going to want to just go ahead and take your pink. Pink highlighter start in verse 7 and highlight every time you see verse love until the end of the chapter from 7 to 21 There might be more but I have to the outside 27 loves [00:42:00] 27 times in verses 7 through 21 John talks about love love love love and how much God loves us and we love him.

So we're gonna read a couple of these verses. So Kristen I, I just kind of want to read all of them almost, but is there anything that's, like, of all those verses, do you have anything highlighted the most?

Kristen Walker Smith: Um, I mean, verse eight. Okay. The defining of God as love, that one is definitely. I also have 18, which I would love to talk about, but yeah.

I just love verse eight. So it says, He that loveth not knoweth not God, for God is love. And. I mean, he could be talking about Jesus or Heavenly Father here, but I love that definition that we don't have to fear God because God is love. Everything he does is out of love for us.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yeah. Yeah. Well, in verse 10, herein is love that we loved, not that we loved God, but that he loved us.

Like he loved us first before we even existed. Yeah. He loved us. So much love. Okay. [00:43:00] Verse 18. Tell me about that.

Kristen Walker Smith: Well, I think this is one that, that some people in the audience might get caught up on. Cause I used to as well. And I'm so curious what you have to say about it. Cause it says there is no fear in love, but perfect love casteth out fear.

And for anyone who struggles with anxiety, there is a feeling of, Oh no, what is wrong with me? If perfect love casts out fear, then why am I so fearful? So I would love. The perspective of someone who, who doesn't necessarily live a life based on fear of what the meaning of that verse is for you.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Oh, my gosh.

Because I was like, Kristen, I don't have anxiety. So yeah. So that's why I need you. Oh, my gosh. Well, I think first of all, I, I can see that in verse 18, my answers in 19. We love him because he first loved us. And so knowing again, going back to how he's always loved us. He loves me. Lectures on Faith teaches.

He is love. That's [00:44:00] one of the most profound truths about God. He is love, not even capable of hate, not even capable of dislike. He is only capable of love. If He is love. He is love. And so when I come in, there is no fear in love. Now, listen, there is plenty of fear in love. Anybody who's dated over the age of 25 knows nothing but fear when it comes to love.

And so to say right here, there is no fear in true, real love, boy, that's a level of love that not everybody gets to participate in when it comes to like romantic love, but in a godly love for sure. And for me in my life, there have been times when I had to just trust that God loved me. Even though what I was going through was just awful and a horrible experience.

And I think that's where Satan likes to get me is Satan goes, does he really though? Does God really love you? Because what you're going through right now sure doesn't [00:45:00] look like somebody like, why would a father let their child struggle like this? And as a parent, you want to take away anything that makes your child uncomfortable.

But just recently I've learned. With my youngest, because she's, she gets it like, oh my gosh, that kid, she can, she has me wrapped around her finger. I want to remove everything uncomfortable for her. And she's also my youngest. So I'm like, man, you know what, I'm kind of tired too. So just go ahead. Like, I don't even want to deal with it.

But recently I've kind of stepped up my game and I'm making her struggle and I'm making her, I'm saying, no, you can do this. You're going to do this hard thing and I know it's going to be hard and you're going to hate me for it, but on the end I know that this will benefit you in some small way. And that is so hard, but she knows I love her.

And the fear doesn't come from a lack of love. The fear comes from the frontal cortex, as we've learned from her therapist. Yeah. Out of therapy. But tell me your thoughts, like how did [00:46:00] you get through that? You have been, you have seen it and come out on the other side. Yeah.

Kristen Walker Smith: So for anyone who doesn't know, um, I have obsessive compulsive disorder and it was debilitating for about seven years.

And when I would read that scripture, I felt a lot of shame. I felt like, well, then I must not love God if, if I am so full of fear. Um, but the more I studied that. I realized that it, like you said, it was less about how much do I love God and more about how much do I trust him? Um, and I would think of Joseph Smith talking about how, or how he learned all these things shall give the experience and shall be for thy good.

I had to learn to trust that God, anything he let me go through, if I, if I turned to him. And if I let him teach me through it, that it would all be for my good and it was all done out of love from him. And so that for me was the biggest thing, learning to [00:47:00] trust that God was not angry. He was not waiting with a lightning bolt with my name on it just, you know, for me to mess up.

But that he truly does love me so much that anything that I experience, he can turn it to, to good for me.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Wow. Well, Kristen, just from your experience that you shared and all that you've been through, I just kind of have this like epiphany and I'd love to know your thoughts because I'm thinking if John, it seems like John's main approach to the antichrist and he calls them antichrist by the way, if you wanted to know, it's in first John chapter four, verse three, he uses that term and he'll use it again.

If his His main, his main line of defense is love. So now I kind of wonder if the Antichrist's main doctrine was, God doesn't love you and Jesus Christ isn't real. There had to be something in their teaching, right? There had to be something that they were teaching that would lead John to go, listen, let's start first and foremost, God loves you and I'm going to tell you how much [00:48:00] he loves you throughout here because boy, if that wouldn't get you.

If you didn't start thinking God didn't love you, then why would any of this matter, and why would there be a Savior?

Kristen Walker Smith: Well, and it sounds like this whole Gnosticism thing, it's like, save yourself. And that, a lot of times, is what fear is. Keep yourself safe. Keep the people around you safe. You can't trust God.

You can't trust God's love.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay. That hit me in my heart that you, yeah, that you have to be the one to save Kristen. Thank you. Thank you. I like that so much. Okay. These are such good verses. So, so much love. Let's do one last love verse. It's in first John chapter five. Bracket off verses 12 through 15. And Krista and I will each take a turn reading these verses, and we'll end with these.

Kristen Walker Smith: He that hath the Son hath life, and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: These things have I written unto you, that ye believe on the name of the Son of God, that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. [00:49:00]

Kristen Walker Smith: And this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He heareth us.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: And if we know that he heareth us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him. Do you love those verses? Yeah.

Kristen Walker Smith: I love that word confidence. Tell me about it. That's what we were just talking about. Well, that's what we were talking about, confidence in his love and confidence that it will all work together and we don't have to save ourselves.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yeah. Well, and right here, confidence that he, he just hears you. Yeah. I like that. Yeah. And that he hears the petitions that we desire of him. Oh, I've just, I put a square around confidence and I connected it and I put a square around here with us and then I connected it to petitions and I put a square around that.

Confidence that he hears my petitions because I believe he loves me. Hmm. That's so good. Those. Wow. I mean, [00:50:00] how does, if that doesn't combat the antichrist message, right? I don't know what does. Okay. But it didn't because there's just one more thing that John wants us to know. So we are going to find out what that one specific thing is and we're going to mark it in our scriptures.

We'll do that next.

We are going to start with a quote. It's from Elder Robert C. Gay in October 2018 General Conference, and Kristen is going to read this quote.

Kristen Walker Smith: His love is greater than our fears, our wounds, our addictions, our doubts, our temptations, our sins, our broken families, our depression and anxieties, our chronic illness, our poverty, our abuse, our despair, and our loneliness.

He wants All to know there is nothing and no one he is unable to heal and deliver to enduring joy.[00:51:00]

Tammy Uzelac Hall: So right there, his love is greater than all of those things. I mean, everything you listed, were you like, check, check. I knew everyone. I, every one of those somebody in my life has or is dealing with. So, let's turn and see what John taught us about how he can deliver us from those things. From fear, wounds, addictions, I mean, all, that, that is probably one of the most heavy quotes I've ever heard in General Conference.

Let's go to 1 John, chapter 1, verse 5. Well, I think we have to do 5, 6, and 7 actually, because they're so good. Okay, we'll do 7. Here we go. This, then, is the message which we have heard of him and declare unto you, that God is light. And in him is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in darkness, we lie and do not the truth.

But if we walk in the light, as he is [00:52:00] in the light, we have fellowship one with another and the blood of Jesus Christ, his son cleanseth us from all sin. Okay, so he is light. Let's mark that. God is light and in him is no darkness. Then we're going to go to 1 John chapter 2, turn the page, and we just want to have you bracket off verses 8 through 11.

We've already kind of studied these, but these verses again talk about darkness, so much darkness, and how hating our brothers and walking in darkness, that the Savior will help us out of that. And then somewhere on your page you can just put St. John chapter 12 verses 35 through 36. St. John. Still John speaking, St.

John chapter 12, verses 35 and 36. And Kristen, will you read those for us?

Kristen Walker Smith: Sure. Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little [00:53:00] while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you. For he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth. While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light.

These things spake Jesus, and departed, and did hide himself from them.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Thank you. Thank you. So, I. I've prepped Kristen for this because I know of your struggle. And your testimony is so strong when it comes to how the light of Christ has gotten you through this darkness. And I asked you if you'd come prepared to share a story with us.

Kristen Walker Smith: Absolutely. Um, it's actually been so fun as we've been reading all of these verses in, in the stuff that John has written, because, um, as I mentioned, uh, previously, I suffer with obsessive compulsive disorder and with that came a lot of depression. They were, there was some comorbidity there. I had. You know, a double whammy, and there were, um, literal years where I saw [00:54:00] no light.

Um, I did not feel any peace. I would pray, I would read my scriptures, but there was no reward for it. It was just, it was just what I was supposed to do, but I didn't feel anything except for fear. And, um, I was beginning to get a little bit better and something pretty huge happened that pushed me back down into the darkness.

I had gotten a glimpse of light and I was pushed back down into darkness and I had this feeling that I don't even know if God loves me. I cannot tell. if I am loved by God, and I'm pretty sure he doesn't. Um, I don't know if you remember, Tammy, growing up, the young women's theme was, we are daughters of our Heavenly Father who loves us, and we love Him.

And I took that us a little too, uh, a little too literally, and I thought, well, God loves everyone. But he doesn't love me. And so I was desperate to figure out if I really was loved by God. And so all of these verses we've been reading today, I [00:55:00] love that you told everyone to come with a pink pen or a pink pencil, because I have little pink hearts.

I read the entire book of scripture and I put little pink hearts next to every verse that let me know. that God loves me. Any sign of God's love has a heart, a pink heart next to it. And my scriptures are filled with pink hearts. And it was so slow reading the scriptures is not fast. Okay. Going through the old Testament and the new Testament and adding little hearts next to them.

It was not fast, but over the course of years, I began to realize that my Pages of my scriptures were covered in hearts, and I realized that what the scriptures really are, are love notes from God. That's what they are. It is His desperate desire to bring us home to Him, and His love notes saying, Please come home.

Please be good. Please let me save you. That light and that love came from the scriptures as I looked for it, it was always there. I just had to look for it.[00:56:00]

Tammy Uzelac Hall: I'm like speechless. When you said that the scriptures are love notes. Um, and just the hearts, yeah, filled. Your scriptures are filled with messages of love. I don't think there's a better way to describe scriptures than messages of love. Love notes from our heavenly parents. Wow, Kristen, thank you so much.

How many years did you struggle with OCD? Well, I

Kristen Walker Smith: still have it, but it was, it was debilitating and kept me homebound for about seven years.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Oh my gosh. Yeah. Can I ask how you manage it now? I'm sure there are listeners who are like, well, how did you come out of it? How did it work? Oh yeah. Is there just like an aha morning where you woke up and you're like, God loves me.

Kristen Walker Smith: No, that would be so nice. That would be so nice. No, there was so, so, so much work, but I did, I did refuse to get help for it for years. I thought, well, I can manage [00:57:00] this if I just have enough faith and, and I realized at some point I was like, well, God put me on the earth at the same time as Reese's peanut butter cups.

And he also put me on the earth at the same time as therapy and medication. And so I'm going to use all three to get better. And so it was. years of therapy, and then I, I continue to use medication and as well as the, um, the tools that, that I was given in therapy.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Wow. And how awesome people don't consider this, but how awesome and magnificent.

That's the only word I have. How magnificent to think that one of the key tools you needed was to be reminded that God loved you. Absolutely. I imagine you opening your toolbox and overflowing out comes hearts and love. And then there's like, you know, the heavy anchoring tools, like there's the wrench of medicine and there's the hammer of therapy, but like, just like foam, like it just pours out of your, your toolbox that you are just so loved.

Um, and your scriptures are proof of that. Kristen

Kristen Walker Smith: Well, they [00:58:00] were. And I, I don't know if we have time for it, but, but one of the things, I mean, you were like, Oh, was there one morning where you were just like, Oh, and I, I said no, but I think that was kind of a lie. And I think I, I might've shared this with you previously.

Um, but if we want to turn to second Corinthians,

There was one day I was holding my third baby in my arms, um, as she was sleeping and I was reading my scriptures. And this was a point when there was no light in my life. This was a point before light had come back in. And I'm reading in second Corinthians chapter 12. about Paul's struggles, how he has a thorn in the flesh, and I felt that so much as I was reading about his thorn in the flesh.

I'm like, I, I feel like I'm all thorns. I'm like, I'm covered in thorns in the flesh. It's not just one. Um, but then he quotes the Lord speaking to him, and there is so much love in these verses. Um, in verse [00:59:00] nine, Paul is quoting the Lord. He says, And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee, for my strength is made perfect in weakness.

And I pictured Paul feeling like he was in an absolute pit of depression or whatever it was he struggled with. And Jesus telling him, guess what? I'm enough. Okay. I know you feel like you have nothing and that's okay because I am everything. I am enough for you. And so then I love what Paul says. He says, most gladly, therefore, will I rather glory in my infirmities that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

Therefore, I take pleasure in infirmities and reproaches and necessities and persecutions in distresses for Christ's sake for when I am weak, then am I strong. And you know, there's a pink heart next to those verses. But that was a point in my life where I saw light for the first time and I thought, maybe this is God pulling me to him.

Maybe God is hoping and just [01:00:00] waiting for me to let this be the thing that pulls me so close to him because that's what he wants. He wants desperately for each child to be so close to him. And so when I saw my OCD as an opportunity. As a lesson, as a teaching moment instead of a punishment, that changed everything.

When I saw that it might be coming and God might be allowing it from a place of love rather than punishment, it, it changed the entire thing. That was the turning point.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Mean it goes back to then when you ask that question, is God a mean God or a loving God, a God of wrath? Like no, your God is a God, a teachable God who loves you.

You can just see it play right there. Yeah. Okay. So do this for me really quick then. All I want you to do is speak into your microphone. To 20 years ago, Kristen, to the little Kristen's in the world today, what is your advice?

Kristen Walker Smith: My advice [01:01:00] is to, to let God love you, to know that he loves you, and that if you don't see it, it's not because his love isn't there, is because you're looking in the wrong places. God is love. Everything he does for you is done out of love. There is no anger. There is no hate in him. It is all 100% love.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Amen. I am bawling my eyes out. Wow. The spirit was so strong when you said that. Thank you. Thank you, Kristen. Wow. That was so good. Okay. Let's all take a breath because that was awesome. Okay. So here's what we do then in the next segment, Jude, who is he? What did he have to say in just 25 short verses?

We'll talk about that next.[01:02:00]

Okay, I just want to know, what is an antidote? Do you know what an antidote is?

Kristen Walker Smith: I mean, it's the thing that makes you well when you're sick. Like it's, it's... Yeah. Yeah? Does that work? I'm not a doctor. I don't know.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: I'm not a professional, Tam. Right? Come on. Okay, you have a good point. In your mind, when you think, like, when is the most emergent time that you would need an antidote?

Quick, we need to get an antidote.

Kristen Walker Smith: I mean, a snake bite, right? Like venom. Oh, yeah. In your blood.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Mm hmm. Totally. That is what I thought of because when I was reading the book of Jude, I found out it contains a very important antidote for our day. And the poisons that we can become infected with are found in Jude.

Isn't this so fascinating? It is. And it almost is like a snake bite. because it, sometimes the venom gets in us and it is so fast with us that it goes straight from the bite to the heart and you didn't even have time to get the antidote. And so Jude is going to prep us for this. So let's go into the book of Jude and we're going to go to Jude chapter one, [01:03:00] because there's only one chapter.

Do we get to talk about who Jude is, by the way? Yes. In fact, I'll let you do that. Hit it. Oh. While we're turning there. Okay. You want to tell us who? This is so fun. Tell us. I'm going to let you have the fun with this. Okay. Tell everybody who Jude is.

Kristen Walker Smith: Jude is Jesus's half brother who did not believe in him until after he was resurrected.

I don't know how you could grow up with Jesus and not believe he was the Messiah, but

Tammy Uzelac Hall: I don't know. There's some questions we're going to have. Yeah, Jude and James, like, come on guys, didn't he do something, like, I don't know. It's fascinating to me because not only did they, but not only did they not believe in him, they made fun of him in the scriptures.

The stories tell us they mocked him. And now we have this turnabout where they're not even just believers. Now they're going to be missionaries and apostles like that is so awesome. Okay. So yes. Anything else about Jude? No, do you have more? No, that's what I got. I think it's great. Now that you know that about [01:04:00] him, then it's going to add even more power to his words.

So let's go into Jude chapter one and we're going to look at verse four. Verse four is the poison that Jude is warning us about. Okay, here we go. Verse four says, for there are certain men crept in unawares, highlight unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men. Turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, underline that, and denying the only Lord God and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Okay, unawares, the word means stealthily. So there are certain men who crept in stealthily, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation We have ungodly men turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, mark that. That means sensuality. It's not interesting that it would mean that. Sensuality, making it so ungodly and denying the only Lord God and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Now that seems like big words [01:05:00] for us, but it describes our day. This is a pattern of apostasy. Do you see things creeping in stealthily? Do you see teachings turning godly stuff into sensuality stuff, like, just, yuck? Is this real?

Kristen Walker Smith: I like that phrase though, and I'm very curious about that, how you see this, the turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness.

What is that? What is that to you? What

Tammy Uzelac Hall: does that look like in real life? Oh my gosh. I mean, when I read that turning the grace, so the grace is divine means of help. Yeah. Divine assistance, turning divine assistance of our God into sensual stuff, sensuality. I think it kind of maybe even goes back to what you said, where we think we can do it on our own, where we're looking, we're looking here and looking there.

We're looking everywhere around, around us for answers to our problems [01:06:00] as opposed to looking up. I like, I think about how many times do we follow people on Instagram because we like one thing they said. And then sometimes we end up going, wait a minute. I don't know if this is quite right, but it sure was flowery when I heard it.

Like it appealed to my human, it appealed to my natural man. But did it, but did it appeal to my soul? Interesting.

Kristen Walker Smith: What do you think? Well, I was looking at that and I, I am looking up the original, um, meaning of that word lascivious. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, and, and one of the biblical uses of that word is excess.

Mm. I think that some people do take the grace of God to excess. That we think, well, it covers everything. And so I can do and be whomever I want because I'm saved by Jesus. I think that is excess.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Ooh, I've never thought of that before and I love it. Yes, take a grace of God [01:07:00] into excess.

Kristen, that is so good. I think you're right. I think that's what it means.

Kristen Walker Smith: Well, I think it can mean both. I mean, why not? I think it absolutely means both.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Turning the grace of our God into excess and denying the only Lord God and our Lord Jesus Christ. Yeah, because then if everything's covered, you're not going to Him as often as you need to.

Right.

Kristen Walker Smith: You're not trying to become like Him. You're denying Him.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yeah, because grace covers all of it. Oh, I think you're totally right. While grace is so important, I think it is. It's kind of the natural man in us to think, It covers, it covers more than I think it should maybe. I like that. Excess. Mm, that's good.

Okay. Well, now that we have this, this is the poison, let's go to the antidote. Go to Jude 1 and we're going to look at verses 20. [01:08:00] And we're going to number all of the things in here. So Kristen, I'm going to have you read it.

Kristen Walker Smith: Okay. And I cannot wait to hear what you say about verse 23. Okay. But ye beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost, keep yourselves in the love of God.

Looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life, and of some have compassion, making a difference, and others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire, hating even the garments spotted by the flesh. Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, to the only wise God our Savior, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever.

Amen.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Amen. Let's number these. Here we go. Here's the antidote. Verse 20. Building up yourselves on your most holy faith. 2. Praying in the Holy Ghost, or with the Holy Ghost. 3. Keep yourselves in the love of God. [01:09:00] 4. Looking for the mercy of our Lord, Jesus Christ, unto eternal life. Number five, and of some have compassion making a difference.

Don't you love that one? I do. Have compassion. What a great antidote. Yep. To grace excess. I love that. Having grace in excess. And then others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire. Hating even the garments spotted by the flesh. Oh, that is a powerful verse.

Kristen Walker Smith: It sounds so weird. It does.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: But it does. Yeah.

It's powerful. Go. Tell me about it. What are your thoughts? Oh, no, I literally,

Kristen Walker Smith: I had to go through that one a couple of times and be like, well, what the heck is he talking about? But I love that. Like some people you can just have compassion on them and love them and other people. They need a little bit of help to get pulled out of that fire and to, and to be pulled away from Satan.

Some of them are going to need like literally being ripped away from the jaws of hell and you're going to be part of that. That's

Tammy Uzelac Hall: exactly it. Yes. Oh my gosh. [01:10:00] Hard to do. Yeah. And then the blessing comes 24 and 25 now into him that is able to keep you from falling and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy.

And I love how you read this at the end. To the only wise God, our savior be glory and match. Remember it's his brother. I like that his brother to the only wise God, our savior be glory and majesty, dominion and power both now and ever. Amen. What a great way to finish this discussion about love, about being, you know, when things come to you that are not quite right.

I love teachings, anti Christ teachings forever. We think that's a Book of Mormon term. It's from here. Like anyone who's trying to take the place of Christ, that's what's so amazing because you think anti is against Christ and it's not necessarily against Christ. It's someone who's trying to take his place saying, Oh, I can save you.

Follow the words that I have to share. And that the message is, it's just about love, just love and keep the commandments, right? [01:11:00] I love that. Yeah, I think it's pretty awesome. Okay, that's our discussion. That is the books, three books of John and Jude. How about that? We did it.

Kristen Walker Smith: Pretty awesome.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Okay, Kristen, I just have one more question for you.

Ooh, what? What's the sixth commandment?

Kristen Walker Smith: Oh, uh, six, six, don't kill.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: What's the fifth commandment?

Kristen Walker Smith: Oh, five, hive, honor your father and your mother.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Oh my gosh. What's the eighth commandment? Eight, eight,

Kristen Walker Smith: gate, uh, thou shalt not steal. Yes.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Yes. One.

Kristen Walker Smith: Uh, one son. And no other

Tammy Uzelac Hall: gods before you. Holy cow. How about four?

Kristen Walker Smith: Four. Door. Keep the Sabbath day holy. Seven. Seven. Heaven. Uh, no adultery.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Oh my gosh. Three.

Kristen Walker Smith: Three. Tree. Uh, don't take the name of the Lord in vain. Five. Five. Didn't we do that?

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Hive? Oh, sorry. Nine. Okay.

Kristen Walker Smith: Nine. Line. Oh, line. Uh, don't bear false witness. [01:12:00] Two. Uh, Tushu, uh, no other gods, uh, no graven images. You did it!

You know all

Tammy Uzelac Hall: the Ten Commandments in order! I

Kristen Walker Smith: give credit to you. You

Tammy Uzelac Hall: taught that so well. Oh my gosh. Well, thank you. You're welcome to use it. I gave you permission. Put it on your YouTube channel. Let's just bring kids to the commandments. Listen, if we're told to keep the commandments, we better know the commandments.

We of all people. Members of the Church of Jesus Christ, we got to know the Ten Commandments. So, oh my gosh, I love you, I love you. Okay, take a second and just gather your thoughts. What's something you learned from today? What's your takeaway from our discussion?

Kristen Walker Smith: I guess, I guess my takeaway and the thing that has been burned into my heart today from these is, Trust that God is acting out of pure love at all times.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: When you bore your testimony of that, that hit my heart. I believe it with everything in me. And I like how you said that the scriptures are love notes from God. And so I have, I have all, every time I see love, I highlight it in pink or I draw a [01:13:00] little heart next to it. And you're right. It's everywhere in scripture.

And he does love us and we love him. And we show our love for him. by helping mankind. And we do that by keeping the commandments. And I think it was so cool when you said the commandments are not burdensome. They are wings and they do help us to fly. So that was a great quote. So thanks friend. I love you.

Kristen Walker Smith: I love you too. And I love the scriptures as do you.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Oh, how much do we love the scriptures. Yes. All right. I love you, sis. Love you, friend.

Kristen Walker Smith: Have a great day.

Tammy Uzelac Hall: Thank you. Okay. Wow. I feel like I need to like take a nap after that episode. That was so good. Okay. If you haven't already joined our discussion group on Facebook or Instagram, go join it.

It's a great place to share what you've learned throughout the week. You can also ask questions. You can even ask Kristen questions. I'll make sure she gets them and I try to answer anything I can throughout the week. And then on a Saturday we post a question from this episode, which will be a question from our discussion.

So answer and share your thoughts. You [01:14:00] can get to both our Facebook and Instagram by going to our show notes for this episode at LDSliving. com slash Sunday on Monday and go there anyway, because it's where we're going to have links to all the references as well as a transcript of this whole discussion and a glue in for this episode.

So go check it out. The Sunday on Monday study group is a desert bookshelf plus original brought to you by LDS living. It's written and hosted by me, Tammy Uzelac Hall. And today our incredible study group participant was Kristen Walker Smith. And you can find more information about my friend at ldsliving.

com slash Sunday on Monday. Our podcast is produced by Cole Wissinger and me. It is edited by Cole Wissinger and recorded and mixed by Cole as well. Our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. Thanks for being here. We'll see you next week. And please remember that God loves you. And you are his favorite.

Oh, wait, I did count them. Hey, look at me. I did my homework.