Tammy 0:00
Philippians 4:13: "I can do all things through Christ, which strengtheneth me." Now, did Paul really believe this? Or was this just his way of saying that age-old platitude, "That which doesn't kill us makes us stronger." Well, many years ago I asked this question to a group of Seminary students that I was teaching. A very shy and reserved young woman raised her hand and said, "It is true." I asked her how she knew. And she quietly said, "Well, I prayed for nine months." And then she paused. And then she said, "No, no, actually, I prayed every day for 288 days that God would answer my prayer. And while I waited, he strengthened me." Well, that young woman was Elizabeth Smart. And that day I was changed forever. We all felt the spirit of her simple yet powerful testimony. And I can say that Paul's instruction to us is far more than a platitude. It is true.
Tammy 0:58
Our discussion of Philippians and Colossians will have us believing this truth, and what believing in Christ can strengthen each one of us to do. Welcome to the Sunday on Monday Study Group, a Deseret Bookshelf Plus original brought to you by LDS Living where we take the Come, Follow Me lesson for the week and we really Dig Into the scriptures together. I'm your host, Tammy Uzelac Hall. Now if you're new to our study group, we want to make sure you know how to use this podcast. So follow the link in our description, and it's going to explain how you can best use this podcast to enhance your Come, Follow Me study just like my friend Kathy Harvey. Hey, Kathy, you are going to love our guests today.
Tammy 1:32
Okay, you guys. This is my favorite thing about our podcast is each week we're joined by two of my friends, so it's always a little bit different. And this week, we have Ellissa Collet and Colleen Nordberg. Hello, ladies.
Colleen 1:43
Hello.
Ellissa 1:44
Hey.
Tammy 1:45
Okay, this is so fun. So different. We've never had this duo before. So you two, tell us how you know each other.
Ellissa 1:54
Well, she's my grandma. So makes it easy.
Colleen 1:59
Yep. Ellissa's my granddaughter.
Tammy 2:02
How fun that we have a grandma/granddaughter duo here.
Ellissa 2:05
Makes it less stressful.
Tammy 2:06
Oh, it does make it less stressful. I hope it does. You guys are so nervous at the beginning. But like I said, we've known each other forever, for years. How do we know each other?
Ellissa 2:14
Well, you're my mom's sister, so
Tammy 2:18
Shout out to Caralee. I am, I'm Caralee's sister and so that's how we, we're family. And we've been family for
Ellissa 2:23
EVER
Tammy 2:24
What, 20 years?
Ellissa 2:24
Yeah. 20 years
Tammy 2:25
Yeah, at least, 20 years in the family. So this is going to be such a fun discussion. And Colleen is a longtime listener. And, like two years ago I saw her at a mission farewell. Oh, it was at yours, Ellissa, at your mission farewell. And she told me she listened the podcast and the thought was, You should have her on the podcast. And then I was like, Oh, yeah, that's a good idea. But it didn't come back to me until your homecoming Ellissa. And I saw you again. And I was like, she needs to be on the podcast. And Ellissa's home, let's put the two together. I called you. And then we found out what we were going to be studying and our minds were blown with how pertinent these verses of scripture are to your life situations. And so I'm really excited. How are you both feeling about everything?
Ellissa 3:08
I'm so excited.
Colleen 3:09
Good.
Ellissa 3:10
It's funny, because before you called us, I literally told my mom, I was like, Mom, I have this feeling. I need to tell Tammy I need to be on the podcast. I don't know why, but I was, I was literally about to text you, or have my mom text you. And then like you texted me and then I read these verses and I was like, God is real. That's all I can say.
Tammy 3:28
God is real. I got the chills just then - He is so real. Yeah, when we get to that segment, Sissa. I call her Sissa, her name's Ellissa. But I saw I'll probably refer to her as Sissa in this episode. So just everybody know who's listening. But yeah. So Sissa and Colleen, when I read these specific verses that apply to your lives, my jaw dropped. So tthis is gonna be awesome. It'll be great discussion. Okay, well, if you guys want to know more about my guests, please go read their bios and see their pictures which are going to be in our show notes. And you can find those at LDS living.com/sunday on Monday. So everyone grab your scriptures, your scripture journals and something to mark your Scriptures with,and Let's Dig In to the book of Philippians and Colossians. Okay, you two, I always ask my guests, as we're studying the letters from Paul, what did you learn? Or what stood out to you from Philippians or Colossians?
Colleen 4:16
Well, Paul overall, kind of touched me or just hit me because if you looked at him before he, before God visited him, he's the last person on Earth I would think should be asked to go teach the Gentiles the gospel. And it just goes to show that God knows our hearts. And it's good He does because we become judgmental and we look at people think, nah, nah, nah. But look at what he accomplished. He dedicated the rest of his life to teaching the gospel. But he's not someone I would have picked. .
Tammy 4:56
Right? Oh my gosh, you're absolutely right. And I'm grateful you pointed that out. You know, in a couple of weeks, we're going to read a verse of Scripture where he actually calls himself the chief sinner of all sinners. So you're right, Colleen. Like, he would never been someone you would have picked out and look at all the good he's done. Awesome. Thank you. What about you, Sis?
Ellissa 5:14
That's kind of like the same thing that stood out to me. Like, I was just looking through all these chapters and the amounts of time it talks about grace or joy or rejoicing. That's what stood out to me. Like, he's in prison, right? We don't know what his life is like at this point. Like, we don't know what kind of trials he's going through. But yet he's rejoicing, he's so happy.He's just talking about how much he loves Christ, and how much he's dedicating his life to Him. And it's so inspiring, because it's like, I want to be like Paul. But it's like, I don't know. It makes me happy every time I just read through these chapters, because it's just a joyful thing that he's rejoicing of Christ.
Tammy 5:50
Oh, my gosh, Ellissa, I'm so glad you brought that up. In fact, let's do this. Everybody go to the page that says "The Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Philippians." Somewhere next to those big letters, everyone draw a smiley face. I drew a smiley face and I colored it in yellow. And the reason I did this is what you just said, Ellissa, and this is so cool. Here's what you want to know about this book. The book of Philippians is the happiest, most positive and most personal of all of Paul's writings. That's what scholars agree. So I love that you were able to recognize how happy it is because it's his happiest letter that he ever wrote.
Tammy 6:25
And like you said, Colleen, he's in prison. Like he is in jail writing this letter. In fact, this is a really interesting fact: Paul's prison letters are the book of Philippians, Colossians, Philemon, and Ephesians. But we have right here, these are the beginning of his 'prison epistles.' And they were written specifically during his first imprisonment in Rome. So here he is in prison, and yet he is so happy. So I'm grateful you pointed that out, Ellissa. Here's another cool thing about this. Let's turn to Philippians 4:8. Now considering that he's in jail and this is his happiest epistle, knowing that context is going to change the way you say this verse, and we all know it. Philippians 4:8. Ellissa, will you read verse 8..
Ellissa 7:14
Yes, it says: "Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just,whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report, if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things."
Tammy 7:30
Wow. Does that sound familiar to you? What Is that? Which we put next to verse eight?
Ellissa 7:36
The 13th Article of Faith.
Tammy 7:38
Yes. Isn't that cool? Then it says that we follow the admonition of Paul. So here's where we get it from. And I just, now that just changes Article of Faith 13 for me,
Colleen 7:49
Well, I just wanted to comment too, on verse 12, in chapter 1 : "But I would that ye should understand, brethren, that the things which happened unto me have fallen out rather unto the furtherance of the gospel;" Can you imagine how frustrated that Satan must be?
Tammy 8:06
Right?
Colleen 8:07
I mean, he's in prison, and he's teaching the gospel, and everyone in the palace knows about it. And I just think it's awesome. It's kind of like when Joseph was, you know, dug out of the pit, and then he was thrown into jail. He preached the gospel to the people in prison. I just think Satan's probably thought he had a handle on Paul and it backfired.
Tammy 8:34
Totally, Colleen. I'm so grateful.
Ellissa 8:35
I love that so much. I just think it's so amazing how in the Gospel you see this so many times over and over again. God knows these people so well and trusting them, that He knows that they're not gonna be let down by God. Like He, I don't know how to say my thoughts, but God just trusts these people to do His work. And Satan, obviously, he's, like Colleen said, is probably mad and like, why is this happening? I'm tempting you, you're supposed to be sad, but you're happy. But it's because God knows their hearts and knows how much they love Christ. Like once they actually get to know who Christ is, they're literally converted to him for life.
Tammy 9:14
Ooh, hold on. I want to write that down. They're literally converted to him for life. Well, and Colleen, what you said too, especially at the end of that verse. You bet Satan's mad because it wasn't supposed to further the gospel. It was supposed to stop it, putting him in jail. That would have been the end of it. And I love that Paul's like, Nope, we're just gonna keep on going here. Oh, awesome. Thank you so much for your thoughts. That is such a great way for us to transition right here because in the next segment, we're gonna dive into the books of Philippians, Colossians. And we're gonna find out what Paul wants to know and why he is so happy. So we'll do that next.
segment 2 9:46
.....
Tammy 9:56
All right, did either one of you have a chance to listen to that song I sent you?
Colleen 10:00
About five times.
Tammy 10:01
Why did you listen to it so many times?
Colleen 10:04
Well, first of all, because I couldn't understand every single word. So then I went back and found the lyrics and read the lyrics. And then I had to listen to it again. But it was, it's beautiful.
Tammy 10:16
What about you? What did you think Ellissa?
Ellissa 10:18
Same thing, I just love songs about Jesus. That's all I can say.
Tammy 10:22
Okay, so this is one of my favorite Christian songs. And we have the link to the song in our show notes. I highly recommend everyone goes and listens. And then find it, download it, put it on your phone. It is one of my favorite songs. The person that introduced me to this song is Emily Freeman. And it is, she and I, it's probably our go to song. She says that she will listen to it full blast in her car with the windows down as she's driving through her neighborhood. And I feel that way because the whole song, that the main chorus is Philippians 1:21. Let's go there. Philippians 1:21. And Colleen, will you verse 21 for us.
Colleen 11:00
"For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain."
Tammy 11:06
There it is. "For me to live is Christ." Now let's bracket off 21-25, because Paul teaches us a really profound piece of doctrine right here. He says,"For me to live is Christ, and to die is gain;" meaning if I died, it would be awesome too because I would get to see Jesus. But then he gives us some more instruction here. So let's read verses 22-25 and we'll each take a turn. We'll go Ellissa, Colleen, and then me.
Ellissa 11:32
Okay, start on 22?
Tammy 11:33
Please.
Ellissa 11:35
"But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labour: yet what I shall choose I wot not.
Colleen 11:42
"For I am in a straight betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:
Tammy 11:49
"Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you.
Ellissa 11:52
"And having this confidence, I know that I shall abide and continue with you all for your furtherance and joy of faith;"
Tammy 12:01
Now look at 23.The footnote for a). For he says, For I am in a straight betwixt two. I like that, his way of saying, look down below, it says, "I'm hard pressed to choose. Which is better, to live my life here or to die and be with Jesus?" Now, I have a granddaughter and a grandmother - two totally different life experiences, and timing. And I want to know, what do Paul's words in this verse mean to you personally? How do you interpret them in your life?
Colleen 12:29
Well, I can relate to Paul, in the sense that I'm kind of betwixt the two. My husband passed away in 2004. And at this point in my life, there are days I think, you know what? I'm ready to go home. I mean, I'm okay with that, if that was to happen. But at the same time, I feel like I still should be here for my children and grandchildren. And I keep saying in my mind, "no empty chairs", and I've got to work on that.
Tammy 13:02
How old were you when he passed away, Colleen?
Colleen 13:04
I was 50.
Tammy 13:06
That's a young widow.
Colleen 13:08
Yes. And it was fast. It was, didn't last very long. And unexpected.
Tammy 13:15
Can you tell me a little bit about those days following his death. Like right now you have such clarity to say you were right there in a straight betwixt two. But what was it like immediately after he passed away? Were you hard pressed? Or did you already, were you like I'm done, let me go too?
Colleen 13:30
Um, I whispered those words to him just before they closed the casket, come back and get me. Yeah, I was ready to go at that point. I didn't want to lose him. I didn't want to not see him again. And I had to turn, I had to turn to God. And I had to hang on to the plan of salvation. That's my hope, that's my dream and my hope is the plan of salvation and the promises that God has given us.
Tammy 14:02
And can I ask you this: In the 20 years since your husband's been gone, has your life changed and turned you more towards the Savior?
Colleen 14:10
Yes.
Tammy 14:11
How so?
Colleen 14:11
I have to rely on Him. I have to trust Him, I have to hope Him. He's the one I have to go to for everything because He's the one that's you know, got the answers. He's the one that can direct me. And I talk to Bill sometime. I'll talk to him too, but I usually just get mad at him.
Tammy 14:33
Oh, thank you, Colleen. I appreciate you sharing that. What about you Ellissa, how did these words, what do they mean to you in your life?
Ellissa 14:41
I don't know. Like, I've been thinking about this a lot since you've been, like I read this and we've been thinking about it, and I don't know. It's kind of like that in-between like he's saying would it be easier to stay here or go live with Jesus? And like honestly, that's like all I want In my life is to go be with the Savior. That's my one ultimate goal. So sometimes it's like, what is the point of all this? What is the point of the suffering? Like, what is, if I could just be with Jesus, I feel like I could learn more being with Him than here. So why am I here, you know. But I know obviously, like Paul said, I have a duty here. I have things Jesus called me to do that I need to complete here on this earth. And even though it's hard, and sometimes it's like, Man, I do just want to kind of give up. It's like,Nno, I have people that I need to go help. God has a plan for me and I need to trust that no matter what happens in life, He has a plan for me.
Tammy 15:41
Oh, beautifully said. You know as both of you were talking, I think of that platitude sometimes - and maybe people said this to you Colleen - but when loved ones die and we just don't understand why, sometimes people say, Well, he had a more important work to do on the other side, or God needed him to do stuff on the other side, which may be true, might not be true. But I wonder if people would then say to us, You're here because you actually have more needful things to do, like Paul says. God's keeping you on earth because there's stuff you need to do here.
Ellissa 16:10
Yeah, I completely agree. I feel like you can't, I mean, obviously, when we go back to heaven, I'm assuming we're gonna, it's gonna be just a school of knowledge, we're going to learn more. But we can't learn what we need to learn unless we're in this mortal experience. Like, we're not going to learn how to rely on the Savior. And we're not going to learn how to get through hard times, we're not going to learn the full joy of this gospel unless we learn how to be not in the Savior's presence. So I think you're right, exactly right Tammy. We have to be on this earth to learn who Jesus Christ is.
Tammy 16:41
Yeah. And it goes to 24. "Nevertheless, to abide in the flesh is more needful for you." I've seen that with Colleen, for sure. I'm grateful you're still here. I'm glad Bill didn't take you. (laughter)
Colleen 16:53
I work at the Temple on Wednesdays and a lot of times it's hard, because Temple is couples. Let's be honest, the people that are couples, and I just have to tell myself, Well, I'm a couple. I'm just working this side of the veil, and he's working the other side of the veil.
Tammy 17:09
Oh, beautifully put. I really like that. Okay, well, so here's what you want to know about this. It has been 10 years since Paul first wrote to the Philippians and taught them back in Acts chapter 16. And Acts chapter 16 is where Lydia joined the church, the woman who was the seller of purple and her whole household joined the church. So just as a cross reference. So these people are good. So this letter to the Philippians, it's not a letter of correction. In fact, after the word right here on our page, after it says Philippians in those big black letters, I just want you to put 4:1, and we're going to underline in 4:1 what Paul calls the Philippians. So let's go to 4:1 and let's go there. And we're going to underline what Paul calls the Philippians. And Ellissa will you read verse 1 for us.
Ellissa 18:02
Okay. "Therefore, my brethren dearly beloved and longed for, my joy and crown, so stand fast in the Lord, my dearly beloved."
Tammy 18:10
Okay, three things: what does he call them in that verse? His what?
Colleen 18:14
Dearly Beloved?
Tammy 18:15
His Dearly beloved, what else?
Ellissa 18:18
His brethren.
Tammy 18:19
Oh, what, I didn't even see that. Four. "Therefore, my brethren. Loved that. Dearly beloved, and longed for. My
Ellissa 18:28
joy
Tammy 18:28
and
Ellissa 18:29
crown
Tammy 18:30
Yes. And then at the end his Dearly beloved. Like, what do those words tell you about how Paul feels about these people?
Ellissa 18:40
He loves them; he knows them.
Tammy 18:42
Loves them so much. In fact, they seem to be the most faithful branch in the church at this time. And so when we take this idea, "for me to live is Christ," we become something when we apply that to our lives. Turn to Philippians chapter 2. We're going to mark verse 15. When we live for Christ, this is what we become. And Colleen, will you please read for us verse 15.
Colleen 19:06
"That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world."
Tammy 19:18
Okay. I put, I got a yellow Sharpie, and I just put big stars all around that verse because it describes us today. We do live in a perverse nation. We do live in a difficult time, and he's challenging us to shine as lights in the world. So I asked you to think about this question: What does it look like to shine as lights? And do you know someone personally in your life who is an example of this verse, who shines as a light because they know Jesus? So first, what does it look like to shine as lights? What does that mean?
Colleen 19:49
I think a lot of it is your, just your life in general, you know. It's not your Sunday life, it's your life. It's who you are. And I think it's having a countenance, people have certain countenances, a calmness about them, a confidence, assurance. And I think they're approachable. I have a friend,
Tammy 20:13
I like that
Colleen 20:13
definitely shines as a light. And she, people are so, they're attracted to her. They love to just go talk with her. And, you know, doesn't matter what walk of life they're at, but she just, she's like a magnet. They just love to be around her. And I think it's because she makes them feel at ease, and no judgment. And, again, just approachable. They don't even have to know her and she can get them talking forever.
Tammy 20:46
I wrote all those down next to verse 15. Great example. What about you Ellissa? What does it mean to shine as a light? And who do you know?
Ellissa 20:54
So on my mission, something I learned that has stuck with me and I literally love telling everybody this. But so when you're teaching investigators, they're drawn to us for some reason, right? And that reason is because we have this light about us. And I love to think when we're baptized, we have the spirit with us. Like we get that gift which makes us become more like Christ, we have the light of Christ with us. And so I think that's automatically what makes us shine as a light is we have Christ's spirit with us always. I think just using that and knowing that and lusing that with your actions and acting like you are a follower of Christ makes your light shine brighter.
Ellissa 21:32
And so to me that's how what it means to shine as a light is just to follow Christ and to not be ashamed of that light. But somebody who might or has a light because of Jesus Christ, that's like the hardest question. I feel like everybody in my life just has the light of Christ. I can just see everybody's taught me something. So I can't think of one specific person because, everybody,
Tammy 21:57
Yeah, okay. Well, I really appreciated what both you said, and I wrote this down. So you said 'people who are able to shine as lights in the world are approachable, they're kind, there's no judgment. They have the Holy Ghost, they follow Christ and they're not ashamed to do it.' That is the best list we could have come up with for shining as lights in the world. That's incredible. So thank you so much for sharing that, and giving us something to think about. Where are we on that list? And how do we do? So? That is a great challenge for every one of us.
Tammy 22:29
Okay, well, what we're going to do then is in the next segment, we're going to learn about an often passed over story about someone who shined as a light, almost 2000 years ago, and how that light can serve us today. And I cannot wait to tell you this story. We'll do that next.
Segment 3 22:42
.....
Tammy 22:53
All right. So I've asked Ellissa to help me tell thus story. Let's turn to Philippians chapter 2, and I want you to bracket off verses 25-30. Now, in these verses, we have a story about a man by the name of - now this is the craziest name, and we've looked it up so we know how to say it correctly. It's in verse 25 and it says, "Yet I supposed it necessary to send you Epaphroditus.", That's how you say his name. Epaphroditus. Now, according to this verse, I want us to find out what Paul feels Epaphroditus does. How does Paul describe him? So let's read this verse. Colleen, can you please read verse 25 for us. There are five ways Paul uses to describe this man.
Colleen 23:36
"Yet I supposed it necessary to send to you".... that guy, I can't say it.
Tammy 23:42
Epaphroditus.
Colleen 23:44
Yes. Yeah. I love that guy. "my brother, and companion in labour, and fellowsoldier, but your messenger ,and he that ministered to my wants."
Tammy 23:54
Thank you. Alright, let's number these. Number one, he calls him my brother; two, companion in labor; 3, fellow soldier; 4, your messenger; and 5, minister, ministered to Paul's wants. So he's a pretty important guy to Paul. Right? He is a companion. He is on a mission with Paul. He is helping Paul. And what's so interesting about this story is - and again, I don't know how many times I've read Philippians - I don't think I've read this story until now. And when I read it, my jaw dropped and I said, I need sweet Ellissa to help me tell this story. So Ellissa, will you tell us what happened to Epaphroditus.
Ellissa 24:34
Okay. So in all the stories in the scriptures this is the story that relates to my life the most. So in verse 26, it says, "For he longed after you all, and was full of heaviness, because that ye had heard that he had been sick. For indeed he was sick nigh unto death: but God had mercy on him; and not only on him only, but on me also, lest I should have sorrow upon sorrow."
Ellissa 25:00
And so the reason why these verses relate to my life is because, so, sorry, I'm gonna get emotional. But um, my whole life I had planned to go on a mission. That was what I wanted, my one goal in life, the only thing I knew I had to accomplish. So I went on a mission. And then a week before I hit my five months, I got really, really sick. And so I have a pancreas disorder, and so we kind of expected this might happen. But for me, it came out of the blue. I thought, I was on a mission, I thought I was invincible. I thought I was supposed to serve God for all 18 months. And so I got really, really sick; I ended up spending two days in the hospital. And so my mission president called, then he said, You can't be a missionary, you have to go home. And I was like, Oh, oh. It was heartbreaking.
Ellissa 25:57
So I came home and I thought, Okay, six weeks, I can get better in six weeks, I can go back on my mission. But God had other plans, because I've had this pancreas disorder my whole life. They said you can't go back out. Like a miracle that you went out once. And so just knowing that, it's been hard, I won't lie. It's one of the hardest things I have been through, having to rely on God fully, to be like, Okay, I had this one plan and He took it all away. Even though I know He didn't take away that plan, He had a different plan. But, so I love this story that it's in here. Because honestly, when I first came home, I was like, this is only me. Like this, I'm going, I'm the only person who had to go through this. But obviously I know that's not true.
Ellissa 26:44
But I just think it's so beautiful that in these scriptures it says that God had mercy on him, and I truly believe that. For at least in my situation I know, and anybody else's situation who may go through a similar thing, the one thing I learned through this experience of having to come home and having to readjust my plan is that the Atonement is, I always thought the Atonement was repentance and you having to, you know, give all your sins away.
Ellissa 27:14
But it's not just repentance. It's Jesus Christ knows exactly every single sickness, every single pain that you experience. And so the Atonement accounts for that, covers your pains. And He has mercy, He knows you, He knows what you're going through. And so I just think it's so beautiful to know that I even though I was hurting, I wasn't alone. God went through those same exact pains as I did. And that's what got me through it is knowing that it's, it was so hard, and it's still so hard some days. But God was there for me every single step of the way.
Ellissa 27:50
And so Epaphroditus, he comes home, but it talks about how in these versus how they received him with gladness, and that they loved him and that they were sorrowful that he had to come home, but they were rejoicing that he was coming home. And I thought that was beautiful. Because when I first came home, that's how everybody was for me. They were so happy I was home even though I was so sad. They're like, we're glad you're home; you have more plans. God has something better for you. And so I felt exactly like this, like it was sorrowful but were rejoiceful at the same time.
Tammy 28:24
In fact, can I just read those two verses, 20 and 29 because I love the wording. It says, "I sent him therefore." Like I'm just imagining your mission president, 'I sent her therefore, had to send her home.' "I sent him therefore, the more carefully that when you see him again, you may rejoice and that I may be less sorrowful," Like rejoice when they come home, it's okay. And then in verse 29, "Receive him therefore in the Lord with all gladness; and hold such a reputation:" Now that word reputation was so fascinating in the footnote 29c, right here. Don't you love this: "and hold such in," and it's cheerful. It's cheerful and it's honor. "Hold him in honor." Like he came home in dignity. He came home, mission accomplished, whatever you want to say. He returned with honor, all of that.
Tammy 29:15
And I just, I loved this story. He was sent home with high, high commendation from Paul. And you were too. There wasn't any one of us in the family that was like, well, Ellissa didn't get to fulfill her whole mission. Like we all knew; like she did it, five months. And you served an amazing mission. And it was so hard for you. And when we think about this story right here, did Epaphroditus' light become dim because he came home early? No, that would be so ridiculous wouldn't it? It did not dim. And here we are 2000 years later telling his story. And what I want to know Ellissa is how can his light serve everyone today? What's your recommendation to people who find themselves in your situation? Not even home early from a mission, but things just didn't turn out like they thought.
Ellissa 30:05
I think just fully relying on the atonement, like I said. Relying on that mercy that God has, because it really is there. It's all we can rely on, and all we can lean on is knowing that He, you know. It, may not be our plan, but it's His plan. And I think that's something that people can understand the most is that mercy and the Atonement. Because if you don't rely on the Atonement, you are going to let your light dim. But if you rely on Him more, then it will just keep on going. So I think that's just my advice is just knowing that His mercy is there for you, no matter what.
Tammy 30:43
Was there a specific turning point for you or a moment where you felt at peace, even though it's still so hard? Was there a moment where you're like, Okay, I'm home?
Ellissa 30:53
Yes. It's kind of silly. But it took me three months to finally be like, Okay, God, I understand, I get it. But I had the opportunity to go back to my mission for a baptism for someone that we were teaching. And so I think one of the biggest things I struggled with when I first came home was like, I only served for not even five months. So I was 1, I didn't even make a difference. I didn't even teach people. I felt like I wasn't who I needed, who God needed me to be. I didn't change.
Ellissa 31:27
But when I went back to my mission, all these people were like, you helped me become closer to the Lord. I know who God is because of you. And so I think that was when I was, You know what, maybe I didn't get to serve in six different areas, but I served in one area where they all know who Jesus Christ is because of what I did to help them. And so I think that's when I was like, Okay. I did what God needed me to do. And it just felt like, like you said, peace. I felt a lot of peace with it.
Tammy 31:59
Oh, Ellissa. Grandma, what were your thoughts when all this was happening?
Colleen 32:08
I felt really bad for her, obviously, but I understood why she needed to be home. She had one of those attacks when we were down at Lake Powell on a houseboat. And it was scary. In fact, we just packed up and came home. So I get where the mission president was probably like, Okay, I don't, I can't, she shouldn't be here; she needs to be home. And I think the Lord knew when she went out that she'd be coming back. I think He knows all that stuff, you know. We have to find it out, but He knows. It's not a surprise to Him, He's got something in mind for her. He's got a plan for her, she's going to find out what it is one day.
Tammy 32:51
Well, and Ellissa, isn't it so amazing? Let's just think how we started this whole episode when you said it's just such a happy letter. And then I showed you. It is, it is deemed by many scholars the happiest letter that Paul wrote. And in this happiest letter that Paul wrote, here we have what seems like the saddest story. So sad. But Paul's like, No, it's happy. He's including it in a happy letter. There has to be good that's coming out of this. And I think of that with your life. While it seems like such a sad story, it's happy and goodness will come from this. And I like this, again. "Receive him therefore in the Lord with all gladness and hold such in cheerfulness. Like it's okay, it's gonna be good.
Ellissa 33:34
Yeah, I totally agree. Like, I've seen so many blessings being home that I probably wouldn't have noticed, but it's just been a blessing being home and,
Tammy 33:45
Yeah
Ellissa 33:45
God is good. Like, He's good. He knows me.
Tammy 33:50
God is good and your story is happy. Wow. Thank you, sweet Ellissa. I'm so grateful to be able to share that story. Yeah. Who knew? Who knew about Epaphroditus, right?
Ellissa 34:01
Yeah.
Tammy 34:01
All the time's like, who's this guy?
Ellissa 34:04
You just like breeze over it.
Tammy 34:05
Yeah, that is such a good story. Thank you for helping me share that. God is good. I like that you keep saying that. So He is so good in fact, that Colleen knows all about these next verses in the next segment. And she is going to help me teach that powerful concept coming up next.
Segment 4 34:19
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Tammy 34:29
So I asked Colleen to help me teach this very powerful concept and truth. So let's turn to Philippians chapter 3. And I'm going to start in a couple of verses and read through some of these before Colleen joins in. So here we go. Verse 1, I just want us to look at this. It starts, "Finally my brethren, rejoice in the Lord." I mean, let's highlight that. He's going to tell us rejoice in the Lord. And then he goes on to say in verse 2 he says, "Beware of dogs." Now that seems weird, because we're not talking about actual dogs that might bite you. Highlight the word dogs. This is a euphemism for unworthy. people. That's what he's talking about. So beware of unworthy people and beware of evil is the other meaning of the word dogs.
Tammy 35:06
And then he tells us about him. Paul, then will go on and tell us about him in verses 5 and 6, which is a very important setup for this concept we're going to learn. So let's read verse 5 and 6. It says, he was circumcised the eighth day, he was the stock of Israel. He was the tribe of Benjamin. He was the Hebrew of the Hebrews." I mean, that's interesting. Like Paul's really going on by saying, I was somebody. I was a pretty significant person back in my day. And then he's, he says, "as touching the law of Pharisee. Like I knew the laws, people knew me.
Tammy 35:06
And then he says, in 6: "Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless." So he's basically setting himself up for like, I was the man, I was awesome. But I want us look at something in verse 7. He says, "But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ." I like how the NIV puts it, the New International Version. It says, "But whatever were gains to me, now I consider loss for the sake of Christ." Like none of that matters because I get to be a follower of Jesus. And then we're going to read verses 8 and 9. Colleen, will you please read those for us.
Colleen 36:16
"Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus,my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:"
Tammy 36:42
Thank you. Now we're going to use the NIV again, because I really like the way the New International Version puts this. So Colleen, will you read the NIV version?
Colleen 36:50
"What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus, my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage, that I may gain Christ and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith."
Tammy 37:13
Thank you. Okay, Colleen. You have experienced loss many a times in your life. You've told us about your husband who passed away in 2004. But I know a little bit of your story, and so I just want to know, tell me how you relate to Paul's words here. And how can loss bring us closer to Christ?
Colleen 37:32
Well, first, I have a confession to make, Tammy. When we talked, you said if anything comes to my mind, to talk about it. And it was within 24 hours of us talking I was laying there thinking about when he passed, and it was a hard time, it was really hard time. I had a new job, so I would go to work for about four and a half hours and then I'd go to the Huntsman and stay with, you know, with Bill till 9, 10 o'clock. I did that every day, sometimes for weeks, sometimes for days. It's just like, and people would say, How did you do it? And I've always said, I was on autopilot, you just do what you have to do. And the thought came to me the other night, you weren't on autopilot. It's like the poem of "Footsteps in the Sand."
Tammy 38:17
Oh, yeah.
Colleen 38:18
You were being carried by me. And it was the first time I've really thought of it that way. I've always just said, you know, I was on autopilot, kind of taken, I guess, credit for it or just not really thinking about it. So when I think back on that He was, I mean, those days were just kind of a blur. And He obviously was carrying me He knew what I was going through. And I think you can take it two ways: you can get angry, and I had my moments of being angry because I didn't want him to go. As a family we had to make the decision to take him off life support. And that was a hard decision to make because I didn't want to, I didn't want him to go. But again, you can either get really angry and withdraw from the Lord or you can just get on your knees and pray for His peace and that peace that passeth all understanding is there. It is absolutely there.
Colleen 39:17
I can't tell you why, but I have my moments. I did, I still do. But for the most part, I have peace about it. And I have hope, hope in the plan of salvation. And I think, you know, we have trials and tribulations, even though none of us like it, but where do we head when we have those? To our knees. We head to our knees and pray and turn to God. And that's what loss does. I mean, what else have you got if you haven't got a God to turn to who loves you, who you know is there for you and has that plan, and you just have hope in that plan that all things will work to your good. And it may not be in this lifetime, it may be in the next lifetime. But I've learned independence. I've learned I have to trust, I've learned hope. I've learned His mercy. I've learned to rely on the Atonement. It has definitely brought me closer to Christ. Wouldn't want to go through it again, but it's brought me closer to Christ.
Tammy 40:25
Yeah, not at all. I'm curious to know what effect it has had on the way you mother and the way you grandmother? How many children do you have?
Colleen 40:35
I have four.
Tammy 40:36
Okay.
Colleen 40:39
I think I try to become, I try really hard to keep my family together to keep us, you know, glued together. I don't think I could have made it through that without my kids. So we have drawn, we've gotten closer together. But yeah, again, I made the statement 'no empty chairs'. That's my goal. I say, you know, your dad's waiting for you guys. And we've got to be, we got to prepare ourselves. I have a quote, If you don't mind. Can I read a quote?
Tammy 41:11
Please do.
Colleen 41:12
It was from President Nelson and I thought it just was pretty, pretty powerful. And it says, "Some of God's children live as though they are not planning on dying. Others live as if they will face no accountability for their actions. Are we making decisions for eternity or for today only? We cannot set our priorities on the temporal things of this world and be prepared for the eternal things of the next world. Some of us will live long lives, some of us will live short lives. Long or short, our days are numbered. Death is a necessary part of our eternal progression and the fullness of joy that awaits faithful saints. When we understand our existence from an eternal perspective, we understand that death is a merciful part of the plan of salvation. It is the gateway back to God's presence. Death is premature only if we are unprepared to meet God, so we must prepare."
Colleen 42:10
And I think that's just, you know, I think the goal is to keep the eternal perspective. It's hard but worlds, you know, we get caught up in the worldly things and the busyness of our lives, but is that eternal perspective that's going to get us there?And I think that's what Paul was talking about. He lost material things, he lost things that he realized, were of no significance in the eternal perspective.
Tammy 42:36
Absolutely. Wow, Colleen, thank you for sharing that and for sharing your perspective of loss. Alyssa, you were little when that happened? What, what has it taught you - loss in your life? And not just your grandpa, but any kind of loss?
Ellissa 42:51
Yeah, so it's really interesting that like, this is even part of it. Um, so something really interesting, it kind of, like talking about the planet salvation, it reminds me in my patriarchal blessing, it says that I have a special connection with the plan of salvation. And I have a responsibility to use that for people. And it's really interesting, because as you asked us to make a list of like loss that has brought us closer to Christ, everything on that list relates back to the plan of salvation. I have a lot of people in my life who I've lost, and I work as a CNA. In that career unfortunately, you have to, lot of people pass away. And my whole life that has been something so hard for me, like I've never really understood the concept of death. Like, obviously, I understood the eternal perspective, but losing somebody here on this earth has always been so hard for me. And I've never understood the pain.
Ellissa 43:48
But as I've been looking through this list it connects me to the plan of salvation. And back to my patriarchal blessing and that, it just builds my testimony that God knows us because my strongest testimony is in the plan of salvation now, you know. All these people that I've lost or these things I've experienced, there's no way I can deny that. I'm not going to see them again, that's what gives me hope. Losing people's so hard, but knowing I'm gonna see them again is what gets me through it. I don't know, it's just like amazing that lto know that the plan of salvation is real, and that everything that we suffer, and as Paul said, everything that we go through, all the things that we lose, it's okay, because we have Christ. He's there. It doesn't have to be sad, because we have Him to lift us up. And He gets us through it. And so it's like, everything that's a loss, as Paul says, it's also a win with Christ. And so that's just what stuck out to me is, it's just a really good connection to the plan of salvation for me.
Tammy 44:50
Oh my gosh, I love that you just shared that. In fact, let's do this. Let's turn to, there's two really great scriptures that will just backup what both of us taught us. In Philippians 3:14 we'll mark that. And verse 14 says, "I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus." I mean, just to think about how pressing steadfast toward the mark, what is the mark? The mark is eternal life. It's to return to live with our Savior, Jesus Christ and our Heavenly Parents, and that that's the prize. Then turn the page and let's mark Philippians 4:13. And here's how we began. And Colleen can you read verse 13 for u.
Colleen 45:31
"I can do all things through Christ, which strengtheneth me."
Tammy 45:36
And that is, it is true. That verse is absolutely true. And you both have done a wonderful job of teaching that through your stories. So thank you so much. That was good. Okay, so in the next segment, then we get to talk about what stood out to me, and one of my all time favorite teachings of Paul. And we'll do that next.
Segment 5 46:05
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Tammy 46:05
So now we're in the book of Colossians. Let's go there, because we have got to talk about this book. There's something in here that I love so much. So it's written during, again, Paul's first imprisonment as part of his first set of prison epistles that he writes. Now what's going on at the time, it's a little bit different from the Philippians. It's not so happy because unfortunately the Colossians had begun to believe in some false doctrines about the Godhead. So Paul's got to come in and reteach the Godhead. And so right out of the gate Paul starts with Colossians 1:1, and. He's going to set the record straight right here. Ellissa, will you read 1 and 2 for us.
Ellissa 46:43
Yes. So it says, "Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus our brother, To the saints and faithful brethren in Christ, which are at Colosse: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ."
Tammy 46:59
Okay, now I want to go back and read it again. And this time as Ellissa reads it, underline or highlight every time Paul mentions God or Jesus Christ. Here we go.
Ellissa 47:08
"Paiul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus our brother, To the saints and faithful brethren in Christ which are Colossie: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ."
Tammy 47:24
Isn't that interesting in two verses how many times he mentioned Him. Because Paul wants to set the record straight: They're separate people. We have God the Father, and we have Lord His Son, Jesus Christ. So he wants people to know that, and then he's going to teach us the nature of God. So bracket off verses 15, all the way through 20. And I want you to write "The nature of God." Now, I asked you two ahead of time to read these verses, and share with me what aspect of God? Are you like? Yes, I believe that, that is, and it just like resonated in you when you read that about Him?
Ellissa 48:02
In verse 15, like we are, so it says, "Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:" We're literally the image of God, like created in His image.
Tammy 48:14
Yes, good one.Whatt did you come up with Colleen?
Colleen 48:18
Verse 18: "And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning,; the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence. He's our all." I don't know how to put it in words, I've struggled with this. But He is our, He's everything. He was here, He was for us in the beginning. Then he came to earth and He gave His life up for us. And He's now just working with every single one of us to get back home. That's His biggest goal is to get us back to Him and His Father in Heaven. And He, He gave up his life for that. And He knew that from the beginning. In the premortal he knew He was willing to do that. So it gives Him preeminence over everything.
Tammy 49:03
Boy that word is powerful, isn't it? Preeminence. In fact, let's look it up. What does that word mean?
Colleen 49:09
The fact of surpassing all other superiority.
Tammy 49:16
OoH, look at that. The fact of surpassing all others, complete superiority. Boy, that is Jesus Christ, isn't it?
Colleen 49:25
It is. But at the same time, He's, He's so humble about it, you know. He had so much humility. He's here on Earth healing and raising the dead and doing all these wonderful things, and giving all credit to His Father in Heaven. I mean, when I think of, you know, surpassing all others; superiority. Sometimes that comes across as somebody who would be a little egotistical, but that is definitely not Jesus Christ.
Tammy 49:56
Right. Oh, gosh, that's cool. I'm glad we looked up that word. Yeah. And He is so humble as He does it,
Colleen 50:02
Yes. And willing to give all the credit to His Father in Heaven.
Tammy 50:08
Which really is the reason why He is the only one who could have completed the Atonement.
Ellissa 50:14
It reminds me of verse 19. It says, "For it pleased the Father in him should all fullness to all." And that is literally Jesus Christ, like He is the fullness and He gave all the credit back to God. He wasn't doing it for Himself, He was doing it for Heavenly Father. And so I just love that verse that it's like, He is the fullness.
Tammy 50:35
Yes. So it's interesting that as Paul's teaching this, he goes into verse 21. And he says, right here, now listen, those of you who have alienated yourselves through sin, which is all of us, yet because of Jesus you can be reconciled, or you can change from one state to another, and be presented wholly without blemish, free from accusation. That's what 21's teaching us. "And you that were sometimes alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled." So I kind of just defined what that meant. He's like, you can change, that's what it means to be reconciled - to change from one state to another. Like you can do that through the power of Jesus Christ.
Tammy 51:15
But here's my favorite part of this. IF, there's a big old if statement here in verse 23. I want you to circle the word if and highlight that, I highlighted it in yellow, because Paul's saying you can be changed. But if and only if, oh, these verses - 23. and 24, for me are the highlight of Colossians. So fun. Okay, here we go. "If ye continue in the faith, grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the Gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven, whereof I Paul, am made a minister, who now I" (And then this is interesting, because in the Greek translation, there is no 'who'. So cross out the 'who' at verse 24. And where it says, 'now', put a capital N.)
Tammy 52:04
Because the Greek translation says, "Now I rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church." Now let's go right here. Here's our big old if statement. If you want to be able to change, if you want to be reconciled, this is the IF what you have to do. Number one, continue in the faith, going back to verse 23, #1. Let's number these. Continue in the faith. The 2nd: grounded. Another word for grounded in the Greek translation is 'established.' Now, I thought this was kind of cool, because then I had me thinking like, there's different ways of viewing grounded.
Tammy 52:44
In fact, just last week, if you remember, if you heard it, we had Elijah who's getting ready to go on a mission. And he just talked about how he can't wait to be grounded. But he applied grounded to when he gets grounded at home. And he's forced to do things he doesn't want to do. But he knows it's for his good, his own good. And he felt like that was what his mission was going to be for him and he couldn't wait to be grounded.
Tammy 53:01
But I thought this was interesting, because I kept thinking about the word grounded. And for some reason, in my mind popped the idea that you have to ground a live wire, like an electric wire or something when you're building a house. So I reached out to my friend Bart Amundson, he is a big time construction guy. And I asked him, What does it mean to ground wires? Like why do they have to be ground when you're building a house? And he, listen to this. He said that grounding wires is when you build something, to have things electrically grounded, means the electrical system in the house is connected to something that is in direct connection to the earth. Now why do you have to have it connected to the earth? Because if there's an electrical surge, the extra electricity is transferred to the earth and not a person or something combustible in the house. So grounding, save lives.
Tammy 53:50
Now that blew my mind right here, because then we go, grounded. So continue in the faith, grounded and settled. And settled means firm. So if something's grounded or settled, I think the idea that it's, it can save lives, spiritually speaking, it can save your life. And then we have "be not moved away from the hope of the gospel." That's the 4th thing. "be not moved away from the hope of the gospel." Okay, to the outside of verse 23 let's put this cross reference. Just put Colossians 2:6-7, it's on the other side of the page. So 2:6-7, because he's going to use kind of the same wording right here and we're going to connect it. Six says,"As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him. There's our 5th thing instruction - walk in him.
Tammy 54:40
And then in verse 7, "rooted and built up in him." Boy I love that, "rooted and built up in him." So rooted is 6. built up is 7, and then it says "stablished." Now the Greek translation of that word is "to be strengthened," to be strengthened in the faith. That's our 8th thing. To be strengthened in the faith, as you have been taught. And then we have 'abounding'. It says "abounding therein with thanksgiving." But in the Greek translation, it's not therein; it just says "abounding in it", meaning the gospel. "Abounding in it with thanksgiving." Abounding in it: abounding in faith,ounding in the gospel.
Tammy 55:23
So all of this, like we just talked about all of this, the big IFs are, and I'll go over them one more time. Continue in the faith, grounded, settled, being not moved away from the hope of the gospel. And then we went over to chapter 2:6-7, "walk ye In him, you're rooted, you're built up, you stand firm in the faith as you've been taught or strengthened. And then you abound in it, you abound in the faith with thanksgiving. Okay, with all of that now, I'm sure your minds are going crazy. So this advice was given to the Colossians who believed in a false doctrine. They didn't believe in a Godhead, I want to know from both of you, what does it look like in your own life? Or what are some examples of continuing in the faith grounded and settled and rooted in Christ? What images do you have when you hear those words?
Colleen 56:12
To be steadfast, to be, to know that you are a child of God, to know with confidence that you have a Father in Heaven, who loves you, a Brother who gave up His life for you, that you are entitled and have the gift of the Holy Ghost with you. I think the basics. I think if we are really firm in the basics, then the others just kind of come along with it. You know what I mean? Those are the basics. I'm a child of God, I have a Father in Heaven who loves me. Joseph Smith was a prophet of God, he brought the, restored the gospel here on the earth today. And I think those are some pretty basics, that we have to be grounded and firm because we're going to need that in the days ahead.
Colleen 57:00
I mean, the Prophet's telling us time and time and time again to increase our spirituality, the ability to hear Him. We're going to have to have that in the days ahead because there are going to be, you know, people who are going to profess to know things, to change the way the things are rea, or interpretation of things. And if we're not grounded, we're not going to survive. And I just hope, that's my goal is to make sure I stay grounded and firm and continue to have hope in my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, and bring my family with me.
Tammy 57:43
Wow, great, great insights on that, Colleen.
Ellissa 57:48
So for me, when I was thinking of being grounded and settled in Christ, it reminded me of a definition of faith that I've heard where it's like, the definition of faith is continuing to follow all of God's commandments, even when they might not make sense. And to me, it's kind of thinking like, Okay, if I want to be with Christ, I have to follow Him no matter what. I got to, I might not understand some, what things are, some things that are happening, but I can lean back and say, Okay, God, I trust You, You've got me. And so for me, being grounded in faith is like putting all my trust and faith in Him and being, You've got me no matter what.
Ellissa 58:23
And so when I look at these verses, it's, some people might see them as like a checklist of things I have to do, or there's a list of things I have to do. But for me, it's like, no. Continuing in faith, okay, I can do that. Having hope, I can do that. Being thankful, I can do that. Walking with Him, I can do that. So it's not an overwhelming thing, it's just being like, Okay, God, I'll do it. This is easy things that I can just be like, You've got me, I can do this for You.
Tammy 58:52
Oh, that's a great one, I wrote down following the commandments, even when they don't make sense. That's grounded, that's rooted, that's settled, for sure. And, when you do that, you get stronger. It strengthens your resolve, it strengthens your testimony. And when you think about how roots, they grow deep, but then they intertwine with other roots, and it's what allows trees to stay standing is they find strength with each other. And so I'm thinking of all of us as trees. And Isaiah teaches this, that Trees of Righteousness is what he calls us. And that we, our roots are hopefully, you know, joining together because we're just doing the things we're asked to do. So, thank you, both of you. Great examples. Let's read this quote by Elder Oaks and what he has to say about these verses of scripture.
Ellissa 59:41
Okay, it says, "We must seek to be firmly rooted and converted to the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We achieve this conversion by praying, by Scripture reading, by serving, and by regularly partaking of the sacrament to always have a His Spirit to be with us. We must also seek that mighty change of heart. that that replaces evil desires and selfish concerns, with the love of God and the desire to serve Him and His children."
Tammy 1:00:08
Thank you. So he just added additional insight to what both of you already said. I really like this quote, because he uses this Colossians 2:6-7 in his talk. And think about that. I mean, "by regularly partaking of the sacrament." That one struck me because sometimes in the summer it's hard and we're traveling and we're busy. And there might be weeks you go without taking the sacrament. And now he's saying, No. Regularly partaking of the sacrament, you will always have His Spirit to be with us. That one stood out to me.
Ellissa 1:00:36
I just love this whole idea of being converted to Christ. And that's what's gonna get us through these hard times, or like, just through anything. It's gonna, it's gonna add strength in our testimonies. I just, it's not this big challenge to be converted to Christ. Like, it's just following him. And I just love that. You know, it's like, these little things that we can do every single day to become converted to Him.
Tammy 1:01:03
Absolutely. And in fact, I think in the next segment, we're going to discuss a way maybe sort of like a, a really great jumping off point to do exactly what we've talked about, and what you talked about Ellissa, being converted to Christ. So we'll do that next.
Segment 6 1:01:18
.....
Tammy 1:01:28
All right, you two. Let me ask you this question: How important is salt to you when you eat?
Colleen 1:01:36
It's extremely important to me.
Tammy 1:01:39
Why?
Colleen 1:01:40
Well, I don't smell. I have, I lost my sense of smell in a bike wreck when I was, years ago. So it has kind of tainted my sense of taste. So I have to have salt on everything. It's either salt or sugar.
Tammy 1:01:57
Oh, wow.
Colleen 1:01:58
Or I't just can taste it. So yes, salts really, yeah.
Tammy 1:02:02
Very important, because then you can taste stuff. I like that. I like that a lot. Ellissa, is salt important to you? You're still young. I feel like it got more inportant as I got older.
Ellissa 1:02:12
Yeah, I don't really pay attention. So
Tammy 1:02:14
Yeah, you're too young to appreciate. I put salt on without even tasting something first, because I know I'm gonna need salt. Are you like that Colleen? Like, I don't even to tast it.
Tammy 1:02:21
Oh yeah.
Tammy 1:02:22
I know. I'll need more salt. Yeah. Salt is so important. Okay. I want us to be thinking about salt because Paul uses a fabulous metaphor involving salt. Let's go to Colossians 4:6. K. and here's some instruction that he gives us. And I can't think of a better way to come unto Christ than this. Colossians 4:6. And Ellissa, will you read that please.
Ellissa 1:02:46
Yes, it says, "Let your speech be alway with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man."
Tammy 1:02:55
Okay, so obviously, let your speech always be with grace. Sure, no problem. But this phrase "seasoned with salt?" This is so cool. Because what this means is, instead of tasteless nonsense, like, not interesting. Isn't that, I really like that. "that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man." And answering every man in the way that Paul answers every man, and here's some really cool information I want to give you. So Philippians and Colossians. And you can write this anywhere you want. Maybe I would probably write this, turn the page and go to the very end of the book of Colossians. It ends with verse 18. And here's what you want to write: "Philippians and Colossians is a total of 199 verses. Out of the 199 verses, 135 of the verses mention Jesus, God, Christ, or Lord. Isn't that amazing? 135 verses that mention Jesus, God, Christ, or Lord.
Tammy 1:03:58
Paul walked with, Paul spoke about, Paul lived for Christ. And he spoke of Christ always. And so this is really kind of cool. Because as I was thinking about this, I thought, There's got to be something about this, like, what does it mean to to speak with salt? What does it mean to be like Paul? And I thought, I need, we need to do a Paul challenge. And I want to challenge all of us to try to speak of Christ and of God as much as Paul did in 199 verses. And I gave you guys this challenge a week ago, when we knew we were meeting. And I challenged you to speak of the Savior daily and keep track of what that experience was like, or if there were any stories that you'd have to share. How did it go taking the Paul challenge?
Colleen 1:04:49
It went, it went well. There's a couple of time days I admit I kind of struggled to find someone to, you know, approach the, to talk about the Savior. But I did it. And one of them was my epiphany that I had when I shared that with someone who isn't really a believer, but I wanted them to know that that's, you know, it was to me, it was definitely revelation given to me after how many years that I've just kind of not given the Lord credit for that. And I did feel really bad about it. But it felt good to share that and just be able to let them know I believed that. And I told 'em that.
Tammy 1:05:34
And how did they accept it?
Colleen 1:05:36
With silence.
Tammy 1:05:38
Did they hate you?
Colleen 1:05:40
No, no, I don't think so. But just you know, no comment, which is fine.
Tammy 1:05:44
Yeah
Colleen 1:05:45
I said it. And, but it felt good. It felt good to have some good conversations with a few people about God, our Father,
Tammy 1:05:59
I think that's awesome. What about you, Ellissa?
Ellissa 1:06:04
I thought this was actually a really fun challenge. Like, I was kind of annoying with my mom. Because every five seconds, I'd be like, I'd just like mention Jesus Christ, like for fun, right? But I actually have a really cool experience that I want to share. So I had this impression to text one of my friends. She also came home from her permission early, too. And so I had an impression to text her and just invite her to the temple this week. And so I was like, Hey, I have a Temple appointment, do want to come with me? And she was like, Yeah.
Ellissa 1:06:36
And so we went to the Temple. And the whole time, she was just crying. And I was like, Oh, no. I just felt bad. And she told me afterwards that, she's like, you know, That was an answer to my prayer, because she had a family member who had just passed on. And she's like, I needed you to invite me and talk about the temple and talk about the plan of salvation with me, because that's what I needed. It helps me move on. And so I was like, oh, yeah. I was just following what God told me, but I'm so glad I listened, because it helped you. But I just thought that was cool that, you know, God really does use you.
Tammy 1:07:13
Oh, he absolutely does.
Colleen 1:07:14
You are still serving your mission.
Tammy 1:07:17
Oh, for sure. It's a happy story. It's still a happy story. Oh, thank you for taking that challenge. I think it's just important for us to really, I'm going to challenge everyone to take the Paul challenge, the Seasoned was Salt challenge, and to really speak of God and Christ this week, more often than you do. And to keep that in mind. Maybe even say, try to say His/ Their names 135 times, I don't know. Seems like a lot but it'd be interesting if you could get close to that. But I'm going to take the challenge. And I'm going to try to work Their names into more conversations that I have with people and with family members, because I want to be counted as one like Paul.
Tammy 1:07:55
I want to be able to be rooted and grounded and settled and converted to Christ. And not just in my actions, but also in my speech. And that takes a lot of bravery and a lot of courage and a lot of boldness, but I think if we can do that, I think that it will almost kind of change some of our relationships. And mostly, I think it will change the way we feel about our Savior and our Heavenly Father, if we speak of Them. So I challenge everyone to take the challenge. Thank you both of you for doing that.
Tammy 1:08:22
I'm looking forward to hearing back from people if they take that the Seasoned with Salt Challenge to make your conversations more about God and Jesus Christ, and less about things that are not interesting. Or things that are lacking. So try that this week, try to say their names, and maybe even try to say their names 135 times. That might be your goal, do it as many times as Paul did or as in many verses as Paul did. So. Thank you, ladies. Thanks for being on the podcast today.
Ellissa 1:08:48
Thanks for inviting us.
Colleen 1:08:50
Thank you.
Ellissa 1:08:51
WOW! You did great.
Tammy 1:08:52
You were awesome. Okay, so just take a second and gather your thoughts. And what's one thing that stood out to you from our discussion today? What's your takeaway?
Ellissa 1:09:02
For me, it was learning that like being grounded is like a way of saving lives and so like being rooted to, grounded to Christ is literally saving your life. And so I think that is so beautiful to know that we just have to be with Christ and He'll save us.
Tammy 1:09:19
Perfect, good one.
Colleen 1:09:22
I'm thinking I have a couple of them. I think, I've been going over this, probably for the last week. Live in Christ, that's how the way he says it - live in Christ and really what that means. And I think after this discussion I'm more aware of what it means and I've got to try harder to live in Christ. And I think it means having the eternal perspective more often than not. And I do lose sight of that many times. But I think having that perspective more will help you stay grounded and firm and have hope.
Tammy 1:10:00
Oh yeah, you know what? I'm going to add that really quickly to the list you helped me create. To walk his children of light is to have an eternal perspective. You just made me think of that. Thank you, Colleen. Okay, my takeaway for sure, I'm gonna go back to how we started. Because Colleen, I really liked your perspective, I had never even considered that Satan must be so mad because he finally got Paul arrested, and he's still having success. And I just, I'm like, you're right, that was so good. And, and Paul didn't even care. He's like, You know what? I'm going to count this as an advantage. We're still going to move forward.
Tammy 1:10:34
So that was so cool. And then Ellissa, you said, I want to be converted to Jesus for life. And you did that when you were out serving your mission. When you went back, you realized "people were converted to Jesus Christ because of the short time that I spent there." And for me, knowing that about you and your mission, you were a successful missionary, successful. You are a shining example of what good can come no matter how much time you're given, and that we're going to just welcome you home cheerfully. You served a great mission and we're just happy to have you home.
Ellissa 1:11:09
Thank you. That means a lot. Really.
Tammy 1:11:12
We love you. Good job. So thank you, both of you. I love you both. What a great day.
Colleen 1:11:15
Thank you.
Ellissa 1:11:16
Yes.
Tammy 1:11:17
All right. Well, I cannot wait to find out what you guys learned. So if you haven't already joined our discussion group on Facebook or Instagram, go join. It's so fun to be there. Because you can post things that you're learning throughout the week, which I would love to know. Are you taking the seaSoned with Salt Challenge? And how is it going? I want to know, are you close to 135? Boy, that is going to be a hard ask, but I can't wait to see if anyone can do it. That is so cool. And then at the end of the week on a Saturday, we usually post a question that relates to this episode. So go and share your answers and your thoughts. You can get to both our Facebook and Instagram by going to the show notes for this episode at LDS living.com/sunday on Monday and go there because it's where we're gonna have the links to the references that we used today, as well as a transcript of this whole discussion and a glue-in for this episode. So go check it out.
Tammy 1:12:00
The Sunday on Monday Study Group is a Deseret Bookshelf Plus original and it's brought to you by LDS Living. It's written and hosted by me Tammy Uzelac Hall, and today our fabulous study group participants were Colleen Nordberg and Ellissa Colette. And you can find more information about these friends at LDS living.com/sunday on Monday. Our podcast is produced by Cole Wissinger and me. It is recorded and mixed by Mix At Six Studios and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. Thanks for being here.
Tammy 1:12:24
We'll see you next week and please remember, you guys, You Are God's Favorite.
Tammy 1:12:24
Okay, here's how you pronounce it. E PAF Ro de tos.
Tammy 1:12:33
Epaph Ro Detos.. Epah rodetos.
Tammy 1:12:36
Yeah, think of Cheetos. Epaphrodetos.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai