Danny Ainge: The Angels Who Make Us Who We Are 

Morgan Jones Pearson

The Interview you're about to hear is the first of four interviews you'll see in a special TV edition of All In that will air right after the first session of general conference on Saturday at Noon Mountain Time on KSL. You can also watch live on ksl.com. We've worked really hard on this special. We are so grateful for the guests who graciously joined us and we think you're gonna love it. There is an iconic photo of Danny Ainge during his time with the Boston Celtics wearing a t-shirt that says "I hate Danny Ainge." Danny is used to being the target of hatred. After all, this has happened since he was a three-sport standout in high school. But he says he recognizes that it was never personal. It was just because people love sports, and he does too. So instead of worrying about it, Danny has leaned into that passion and in the process made a place for himself in sports record books. Meanwhile, he has relied on his faith and his family to keep him grounded and on the right track. Danny Ainge was the National Basketball College Player of the Year and the recipient of the Wooden Award during his time at BYU. He simultaneously played baseball for the Toronto Blue Jays before being drafted into the NBA by the Boston Celtics, where he became an NBA champion twice. After 14 seasons in the NBA, he became coach of the Phoenix Suns and later took a front office job with the Boston Celtics, where he worked for 18 years and won yet another NBA championship. He is now the CEO of basketball operations for the Utah Jazz. He and his wife Michelle are the parents of six children.

This is All In, an LDS Living podcast where we ask the question, what does it really mean to be all in the gospel of Jesus Christ? I'm Morgan Pearson, and I am so honored to be here with Danny Ainge. Danny, thank you so much for taking the time to sit down with me. I know you're a busy man, and I'm grateful for your time. My first question for you is, how did you initially fall in love with basketball?

Danny Ainge

Well, Morgan, I didn't really have much of a choice. I had two older brothers that were three and four years older than me that were real big ballers. And my father was a terrific athlete. And so I started my life out as the ball and worked my way up to being able to play. I remember one time where my mother was a little concerned that I was so obsessed with sports when I was about 10 or 11. And she was maybe wondering if I should not play sports. But that ship had sailed long before age 10 or 11. But basketball is just, I guess it's in my blood. And it was just in my upbringing. And I learned more in my other [sports]. For example, in baseball, I learned more in my first two weeks as a player in baseball in my professional career than I had learned my whole life, and I was a good, good player in baseball and played a lot. Then in basketball, I didn't feel like I learned all that much. I had learned so much in my upbringing that by the time I became a professional that I had learned enough to be, and I still learn, I mean, even today, I'm still learning but basketball has just been part of me.

Morgan Jones Pearson

So you were highly recruited out of high school to play basketball, baseball, and you were even recruited to play football. Is that right?

Danny Ainge

I was probably more recruited in football than any other sport.

Morgan Jones Pearson

It's crazy. And initially you've said BYU wasn't even really on your radar. But Elder Marvin J. Ashton encouraged you to at least give BYU a look. Tell me what it was about your relationship with him that led you to actually consider BYU.

Danny Ainge

So I had a brother, my oldest brother, who was a very good player, came to BYU on a basketball scholarship and at the end of his sophomore year, I think he decided to go back home, marry his high school sweetheart and play DIII basketball and was a DIII All American. But I just I didn't really think that BYU was was going to be for me. And I didn't have anything against BYU. But BYU wasn't giving me the attention that other schools were and I had grown up in the backyard of the PAC-8 in those days and UCLA and Oregon, Oregon State were national powerhouses and I just saw myself from a very young age, being a big Oregon Ducks fan and being to so many games that I just envisioned myself playing on one of those teams. So when Elder Ashton, I didn't know Elder Ashton at the time, he came to a stake conference in Eugene. And I don't know, to this day I don't know, did our state president asked him to? Did my father influence that in any way? My father never tried to influence me toward any school. He played at University of Oregon. But Elder Ashton just asked to interview me. I was like, 'What is this about? I got an apostle coming to our stake and why does he want to talk to me?' So that was nerve racking, but I met with him, he said, 'I would never tell you where to go to school. But I think that if you want to live the rules at BYU, you should at least go on a visit there just to take a look at it.' And I said I would. So it wasn't Elder Ashton that got me to go to BYU, it was that recruiting trip that I went to BYU, it was the people that I met the coaches, the players, the administrators, and my experience there at BYU that changed the course of my life for a long time.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Danny, that is just one example of a big decision that you had to make at a pretty young age. You've had to make a lot of big decisions throughout your life, you had to make a lot early on. Talk to me a little bit about what your decision-making process is like?

Danny Ainge

Oh, wow, that's a big question. So I had to, you know, for me, everybody has to make a lot of decisions at that stage of life, right? We all have to decide where we're gonna go to school, I had to decide what sport I was going to play. I had to decide if I'd played professional baseball at that time and then I got married at age 20. So there's a lot of decisions that I had to make as a youngster that were life altering time in my life. And I would say that I always want to do what's best for me and my family or my future. I, of course, learned in my youth to pray, and sometimes fast and seek the counsel of my Father in Heaven for big decisions. But sometimes life just happens so fast that you don't really have as much time to ponder and think of things through. But I would say that, especially at that time in my life, I sought the counsel of people that I trusted, that I loved, that were smarter than me and more experienced in life than me and listened to their counsel. And I've been blessed to have a lot of good people in my life.

Morgan Jones Pearson

You mentioned that you got married when you were 20. You and your wife had been married 45 years.

Danny Ainge

44 next month. Don't make me older.

Morgan Jones Pearson

That's a huge accomplishment, though. I feel like in our world today, being married for that long, and raising a beautiful family, all of that is huge. And you've done it in the midst of this sports career that is the kind of career that I think a lot of people dream about. So how have you and your wife navigated kind of simultaneously raising a family but also having these big responsibilities professionally?

Danny Ainge

Yeah, so first of all, I mean, I would say professional sports isn't as glamorous as people think it is. It is very challenging for families. Second of all, it does provide financial security. So that is a big thing. I mean, a lot of marriages struggle because of finances. But my wife is a superstar. I mean, she's a rock star, she's so independent and she's very strong. And I guess that's how we made it. I mean, I'll give you a quick story. I was playing minor league baseball in Syracuse, New York, right after we had been married. And she was pregnant. And I get called up, I get a phone call at about one o'clock in the afternoon, saying you know, you got to jump on this plane at three. You're coming to Toronto, maybe for the rest of the year. And you're going to start in the games late this afternoon in Toronto. So I gotta like throw things in a bag and jump on the plane. And then here's this young, 19 year old girl, she's pregnant, she's got to pack the car. She's got to tie things on top of the car, all of our belongings, and she's got to go through a rainstorm and across the border into Canada, she gets a flat tire. I mean, that's just like the beginning of our life. And that is a good picture of some of the challenges that we've had to face throughout but her strength and independence is how she has survived a very difficult and challenging life sometimes. But like I said, I don't want to make it seem like our life is harder than everybody else's. There's just challenges that people don't understand.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Different challenges

Danny Ainge

Different types of challenges. Yeah. And then you know, I don't think, she does not like the publicity of our life. You know, she would like to keep our children and our family and her like out of it as much as she can. I've always liked that about her.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Well, speaking of publicity, and kind of some unique challenges, once you ended up in the NBA, you faced some some negativity, you were booed by crowds and not a favorite amongst opposing fans. Tell me a little bit about what that was like for you, and also your family, because that affects your wife, and kind of how you handled all of that.

Danny Ainge

Well, so first of all, I grew up with that. Okay, so I played high school sports, football and baseball and basketball. And we were really good team and state champions, and long winning streaks, etc. And so we were like everybody's team that they wanted to beat, you know, like the team like Duke that you hate so much, Morgan. That's who we were when I was in Eugene growing up. And so I faced a lot of that. One day I remember I was I was dating a girl from another high school, and she had found through the grapevine at a football game that that I was playing that night, they had this big pot of money for whoever could take me out of the game. Like if they could just knock me out of the game, then the player won this so like, I was determinined, nobody's knocking me out of the game. And so that game, I was playing quarterback that night. And I was running an option and I pitched it and the guy just stuck his helmet right in my stomach and just knocked the wind out of me. I did not want to leave that field. But I had to for one play. I got back on the field. And I was so mad to find out from my girlfriend that somebody got the pot of money for that one, knocking the wind out of me. So anyway, I grew up and so I was not well liked in that time by the opposing high schools. And then I go to BYU and BYU we were a good team in our conference. And every team we played it felt like we were their rival. People were trying to beat, knock BYU off at that time and we were a very good team. So I grown up with a lot of that. And then I got to the NBA and we're with the Celtics, I started my first eight years with the Celtics and we had like four first ballot Hall of Famers I was playing with. And I was kind of a whiner, like, very demonstrative player, you know, wore my emotions, like 'What! That call? Are you kidding?' But I think it had to do with the Celtics, it had to do with my personality. And I was a scrappy player.

Morgan Jones Pearson

A little bit of an underdog mentality.

Danny Ainge

Yeah, I mean, I felt like I was an underdog. But I was, like, when Magic Johnson is coming down on the break, you know, I'm grabbing him attack, you know, like, just holding on, so they don't and, you know, like, fans don't like that. And anyway, I think it was a lot of my personality, some of the Celtics, we were one of the better teams in the game at that time. And that's when it started maybe in my second or third year in Boston. So I was used to it. I didn't worry about it. One game we're playing in Detroit. And like a whole section of people are there like an hour before the game and I'm out shooting before the game. And they have these 'I hate Danny Ainge' shirts. And so I asked one of the guys like, 'Hey, you got one of those shirts for me to wear?' and I was wearing it, shooting, and then they all like started to come down and wanted to take pictures with me. It was another another time where I realized it's not personal. It's just part of the game, part of the entertainment, part of the fun. I learned to embrace that with fans throughout my career. And when I got out of Boston when I played in Phoenix and Portland and played on very good teams there. It wasn't anywhere near like it was in Boston. So Boston was a team that was loved and hated. And I felt like I was a player that you know, throughout my life I was loved and hated. And one time Bill Walton gave me the best compliment he said 'Danny is the only one doing his job. He's the only one that the opposing fans don't like. We all need to be a players the opposing the opposing fans don't like.' Now that was a compliment but that's kind of how I saw it too. Our General Manager, the famous Red Auerbach, if I scored 30 In a game, itt was okay. Like he'd come in as pat me on the butt say, 'Hey, nice shot.' But if I got in a fight and stirred it up, like he was giving me the game ball. It was like I got much more praise for being scrappy and confrontational, and it's hard to do in the game today, you can't really do it because there's just video of everything. And so you can't get away with anything. Right?

Morgan Jones Pearson

Well, I think in my research, I saw a picture of you in the I hate Danny Ainge shirt, so those pictures are still around. I was gonna ask you, do you feel like, you had that persona on the court, seems like your personality is very different one on one and personally. How did you kind of balance those two parts of yourself?

Danny Ainge

You know, like, I didn't really consider myself like this guy that was a fighter. I mean, I think I've probably got in five or six fights in a 18 year professional sport career. I didn't really ever perceive myself as a fighter. I mean, I was scrappy, and like had to to survive, like you said, like I looked at myself as being an underdog. And you know, I had to play well every night just to survive in the NBA, because the talent is so good. And that's how I saw it anyway. And so I didn't really have a conflict. I wasn't really that person that tackled Tree like that's survival. You know, the rest of my life, I was not that personality. I'm more of a laid back personality, like to have fun, like to make light of everything. And that's just who I think I am more like.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Danny, you have experienced a ton of success over the course of your sports career. You were an All-American at BYU, you hit a huge shot in the NCAA tournament that is legendary to BYU fans, and then you end up with the Celtics. And while in the beginning, I believe it was Larry Bird that says that your first practice was pretty rough. But you end up winning multiple NBA finals with the Celtics? What keeps you humble?

Danny Ainge

Oh, man, when you play professional sports, there's a lot to keep you humble. And I'm a golfer, too. So it's a very humbling sport. And I have children and a wife that keeps me humble. And just life life itself. Life gives you losses and setbacks. And there's a lot to keep you humble. I think my faith keeps me humble and grateful. Yeah, I mean, there's just a lot of things to keep us humble. Like I don't understand how people can't be humble, right? Even the very best of players because there's just too much to knock us down a step here and there.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Let me ask you this. You are a man of faith, you've devoted over the course of your career while working in demanding jobs you've held callings that anybody that serves in the church knows that callings can take a lot of time. I know a lot of you will say there is no such thing as balance but how have you managed to prioritize I guess?

Danny Ainge

Well, I think there is such thing as balance. But you know, like we're all not perfectly balanced. But I think we learn in Luke that you know, that Jesus increased in wisdom and in stature and favor with God and man and I've always applied that in my life. Those are lessons I learned early in life from my father used to always talk to me about balance. You can't be a basketball player your whole life, you need balance. And I said, Dad, I do have balance. I play baseball, basketball, golf and track. He wasn't talking about that balance, obviously. But I always did and always have and always still do try to seek balance. Yeah, it's not ever been and I'm not sure it's ever perfect. I still work on it. But I think that we can try to find balance in our life. I think callings helped provide balance. I mean, they they compel me to do home teaching, compel me to teach a lesson or to be a bishop of a ward and help people and to serve. I needed that. Like, I feel like I need to be compelled to do it. Even though my heart is always wanting to do it. It's like, this assignment is giving me that, you know, I need to do it, because I'm a person that wants to do what I'm supposed to do. So I love callings, they've given me those responsibilities. Right now I'm serving in the priests quorum, and I love it. We have 18 priests and you know, it's so much fun. But through the busiest times, were, again, being surrounded by just so many great people. I'm sure every bishop would say that like, oh, yeah, my Relief Society president was amazing. My counselors were incredible and I was just surrounded by really good people that allowed me to serve in the small part that I was doing, and the bigger parts that they were doing. So I'm just grateful that I feel like my whole life, I've been surrounded by good people.

Morgan Jones Pearson

In terms of being a man of faith within a world, I would imagine that the sports world is not squeaky clean. And so how have you managed to maintain your standards? And also, have you had opportunities, either as a player or as an NBA executive, to talk about your faith with those that you're around?

Danny Ainge

Yeah, I think in in mostly a nondenominational way of talking about faith, and talking about God and talking about balance and finding something else in your life. I've had many conversations with teammates, players, I coached, players I managed, most of them don't really want to hear about me or my life or my experiences, or, but there's been players along the way that have said, like, no one's ever talked to me that way before. So I've had some really good experiences that way. And I feel like more than anything, I think my people that I've worked with, from my teammates all the way through my career, I think they know that I've lived my faith. And I think that they've respected it, even though they've made fun of this or that it's been, I think that because I've been able to further my career and go on and have teammates in times of trouble reach out to me and seek some advice or counsel or I feel like my faith has led me to different opportunities in life. But more than anything, Morgan It's just like, I'm just happier. Like, I don't have to deal with so many of the things that I've seen other people deal with, and not just in sports. I mean, I know sports is not a squeaky clean world but the world isn't in any jobs. The temptations are out there in any profession, but having a good marriage and a strong wife. And like I said earlier, I was surrounded by lots of good people early in my life, I think has helped me just stay the course.

Morgan Jones Pearson

That's awesome. You were named head coach of the Phoenix Suns. You were there for three seasons. And then you stepped down, citing a need to spend more time with your family. You said everything had gotten out of balance. Talk to me about making that decision and how that shaped kind of your life in the years since.

Kind of an opportunity. It sounds like to reevaluate and make some changes that would affect your family in the future or affect you in the future.

Danny Ainge

Yeah, I mean, I've been as a player for 18 years. I coached for three and a half years. And I been an executive for over 20 years. And it was only in those few years of coaching that I didn't feel like I had some semblance of balance. And maybe what it was.

I've never really thought that I was gonna go be an NBA head coach. When my career ended, the owner of the Phoenix Suns Jerry Colangelo asked me to coach like at a very early age just a year after being out of the NBA with no coaching experience whatsoever, other than little CYO basketball. But I felt like why not? Let's give it a try. I live in Phoenix here's an opportunity to coach the Suns, which I just finished my career with and so I gave it a try. I liked a lot of things because I really liked the players. Guys in my generation, you know, talking about the players of this generation in not such a great fashion, I see the players of today as just as much fun and they work harder than we worked as players. And anyway, I enjoy it, they keep me young, I really liked their personalities, and I love their dedication to the game. So I said, Well, I'm gonna coach. So I was enjoying it. It was really hard. It was really stressful. I had six kids in school at the time at home, and put my wife through a lot in just my playing career. And now she's the wife of a coach. And so we had an NBA lockout, a work stoppage. And during that stoppage, I knew then that I should not be coaching. But I was making more money than I've ever made in my life, our team was getting better and better, and those temptations just like kept me staying with coaching. So I'm going to try it again. And, but that experience in that lockout probably changed everything. I knew that I needed to not be doing that. And we started the next season out. So I'm starting in my fourth year of coaching and knowing that probably shouldn't be doing this, or I've had that impression but I still do it. And early in the season, our team is playing pretty well. And I just I'm at a game and it's just like, 'What are you doing?' And so I just went to the owner and said, 'My assistant coach is great, he can do this easily in his sleep, and I need to be home.' So what I found out about that experience is I actually thought that my family needed me, and I needed to be home more but what I really discovered after I left coaching was my family was doing okay, my wife was a great parent. And I mean I was a good parent. I wasn't as good a teammate with my wife just because I was always gone and you know, obsessed with my coaching. But I was listening to general conference, and I was taking my messages to my team. You know, like I needed to be taking those messages to my family. But that was just one example. Anyway, I left coaching, and I found out that my family was doing fine. And I needed them. Like I was missing out all the things I discovered how much I was missing out on while we were in a work stoppage. Anyway, I loved that discovery. And that was a fun time of when I left coaching and I went into television at that time. In all the times I've made changes in my life, I never really knew what the next phase was. But I didn't know what I was going to do when I left coaching. But I knew I needed to be home more. And it was for me, not for them like they were doing fine.

Morgan Jones Pearson

So you go to TV from there, and then you end up becoming an NBA executive, which is what you've been doing for years now. But just in the last little bit, you made a big change. You moved, you and your wife moved from Boston to Utah. You retired from the Celtics, and then soon thereafter took a job with the Utah Jazz. Talk to me about that decision to make that change.

Danny Ainge

Yeah, so, you know, again, when I left Boston, you know, it was something that I had been contemplating for quite a while. But I just felt like it was the time to go. In Boston again, I felt if it was in a bad situation, I wouldn't have wanted to leave but I wanted to move away and leave it in a good place. I felt like our organization, the front office to coaching like everything was pretty well set up when I walked away from the Celtics. But now, I wasn't planning on moving to Utah as soon as we did. I was planning on staying in Boston more. My wife is very involved in the community. She has lots of friends back there, she loves her tennis at the club. So like we were going to hang around Boston for a while longer in the transition, whatever that transition was. So our family circumstance kind of sped up that process of coming out to Utah, we were planning on maybe coming six or eight months or a year later. And we ended up coming more immediately out to Utah. So once I got to Utah, now, I've been friends with Ryan Smith for years.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Who is wonderful.

Danny Ainge

He's a great guy. We're very good friends. And I've talked with Ryan in the past year or two years before I left Boston as his dream, once he sold Qualtrics, his dream was to buy an NBA team. So I'd been helping him, mentor him, telling them what to look for, talking to him about the personalities, the process. But I wasn't ever planning on working for him. I was planning on coming to Utah and moving to Provo, which we did, going BYU soccer games, and football games and baseball games with my wife. And I have a lot of friends at the country club down here that play golf that are my buddies. And so that was the life I was looking for in transition to something else, I knew there would be something else that I would want to do. I just didn't know what. But NBA general manager was not on my plate, in my mind. So anyway, I get out to Utah, and Ryan is now pushing me to try to work for him. And I'm saying, Ryan, like, I'm here for you. I want you to succeed, but you don't need to hire me. You know, I'll be your friend, I'll help you in any way you can. But I don't need a job.

And anyway, he trapped me a couple times, he took me on his plane to go play golf somewhere. And he had Tony Finau with him and they were like trapping me in the corner and saying, 'Here's what we need you to do.' And so just wanting to help Ryan, it kind of came clear, maybe I should do something, but I need to do it on my terms because I don't want to get back into the stress that I had in Boston for so many years. And so we worked out a deal. We worked out kind of how I could help him. And he says 'Okay, let's do it.' And here I am.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Well, you've done an awesome job already. And I think it's been fun to be a Jazz fan right now. So thank you for that. Danny, on your Twitter profile, you have an interesting scripture reference. And I'm just curious about what led you to put this scripture. So it's the scripture from the Book of Mormon, that says, 'I know that God loveth His children. Nevertheless, I do not know the meaning of all things.' What is it about that scripture that speaks to you?

Danny Ainge

So you know, we live in this world where everybody is trying to tell us what we should believe. And there's so many experts, I feel like I'm an expert in basketball, but I don't feel like I know more than everybody else. There's a lot to be learned from everybody. But I feel like the same thing in religion and in the scriptures. I love the scriptures. But that scripture to me epitomizes my personality. I don't know the meaning of all things. I have enough faith in people that I trust, that I love, that I've learned. In all the callings I've worked in the Church, I've had so many people that have helped me understand, people that I want to emulate in their lives, people that are just shining their light that have been big influences on me and my life. And I know that God loveth His children. And you know, coming from Nephi, who is one of the most obedient people, we all strive to be obedient as Nephi, I thought it's just an amazing, amazing quote. I don't know the answer to these things. That's why I'm seeking answers all the time in Nephi's perspective. And yet he knows that God loves His children. And He loves all of His children, I would add, so it's a scripture that resonates with me.

Morgan Jones Pearson

Danny, as you look back on your life, how can you see that the Lord has been able to use you? How do you feel like you've been able to be an instrument for good in His hands? How would you express your gratitude for those opportunities that I'm sure in many ways have exceeded what you imagined?

Danny Ainge

Yeah, I mean, again, I would just emphasize the lights and people I mean, when I was in minor league baseball, I had a kid who came down from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, Garth Iorg was playing in the major leagues. And I'm in the minor leagues, and I'm a young kid playing there. And it's a hard life for me in the beginning, not the playing as much as just the life and everything. And so Garth gets sent down from the trip from the major leagues to the AAA. And we hit it off immediately. And he sees some things I'm going through, and he helps me. And it shaped me for a long time, as I go into a professional career. I just feel like I've had people blessed my life all the time, throughout my life, including we talked about Marvin J. Ashton, but my high school coach, my college coach, nobody more than my wife, and her family, and her brothers. And, you know, my big brothers, I've just been fortunate that I've had good people to kind of keep me focused and keep me headed in the right direction. And who knows where your life goes at all these different crossroads in your youth, and there's pivotal moments in our life, defining moments. And I just feel like there have been angels waiting for me directing me in certain ways. And not just as a player, but just in life. And I'm always grateful for those people that have helped shape my life.

Morgan Jones Pearson

I think that's a credit to your humility, as well. So thank you so much. My last question for you, Danny, is what does it mean to you to be all in the gospel of Jesus Christ?

Danny Ainge

Well, Morgan, when I first heard you ask that question, when I've listened maybe to your first podcast that I listened to, the first thing that came to my mind for me is being a sports freak myself is all in means all in no matter what. All in, in every circumstance. And when you're on a team, and you have tough losses, and you don't get the role you want and you don't get the shots you want. You don't get the credit you deserve, or you you feel like you deserve. But you're still all in with the team. So when you say all in, that's the first thing that comes to my mind, am I all in the gospel of Jesus Christ, no matter what the losses are, the losses in life that I'm responsible for, the losses that happen as a result of just living in this world. And so yeah, I'm all in. I'm all in on keeping my covenants. I'm all in on being a disciple of Christ. I'm all in on doing what I can to have as much faith, hope and charity that I can. Thank you so much, Danny. It's been such a treat to be with you and I appreciate your time. Thank you. I enjoy your podcast. Thank you. Thank you for the work that you're doing.

Morgan Jones Pearson

We are so grateful to Danny Ainge for joining us for this special TV edition of All In. Be sure to tune in Saturday at Noon MST right after the first session of general conference to watch the whole special and we hope that you love it.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai