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[00:00:00] Morgan Jones Pearson: On March 5th, 2022, Walker McFadden, a 16 year old, was working with his father on the construction site of the home their family was building, when he was involved in a horrific accident that instantly took his life with his father looking on just feet away. In the days, weeks, and months since Walker's passing, his family has been left to pick up the pieces, and along the way, they've discovered that Walker lives.

It is the miracle we celebrate at Easter. The knowledge that because Jesus Christ died for us and then rose again on the third day, we also will live again. Tamara McFadden and her family have lived in many places, but currently call Utah home. She and her husband, Robert are the parents of six children and guardians of three children.

She currently serves on the young women general advisory council.

This is All In an LDS living Podcast, where we ask the question, what does it really mean to be all in the gospel of Jesus Christ? I'm Morgan Pearson, and I am so honored to have Sister Tamara McFadden on the line with me today. Tamara, welcome.

[00:01:14] Tamara McFadden: Thank you. I'm so happy to be here.

[00:01:17] Morgan Jones Pearson: Well, I wanted to start as I, as I prepped for this interview, I learned that you and your husband and your family have lived many different places.

Um, your husband has talked openly online about how you've been through some difficult things, even financially, and you've experienced a lot of highs and lows as a family. I wondered how has all of this shaped the culture of your family?

[00:01:42] Tamara McFadden: Well, that is a, that's a fun question. It actually wasn't always a fun question for me because I grew up in like this.

You know, a home where my dad kind of had the same job and we lived in the same place for most of our lives. And so marrying, I married this entrepreneur and I didn't really know what that meant. He was a builder. So we would build and sell and build and sell. And we moved a ton around kind of the Utah area when our children were little, then he became this developer.

Which created a little bit more stability, less moving. We remodeled the home, thought we'd live there forever. And then there was a crash, you know, the real estate market crashed in 2008. And we, we literally, we lost everything. And it was hard and in his company that he worked for, all of the owners had gone bankrupt and left everybody just kind of reeling.

And we tried to hang on to everything, you know, temporally, and we couldn't, we just lost everything, lost our home. Um, and we ended up moving and renting this house and. What's interesting about that story is, um, or that experience is that's kind of what changed it. There was a something that happened in that hard that really kind of charted a different course for me or strengthen the course that I knew I needed to be on.

And I remember how these little children. Um, we couldn't really feed them. And yes, we had family that helped every once in a while. And we had, we could go to them and yes, obviously we could reach out to our bishop, but we really felt like, gosh, we got to do this on, we got to figure this out, you know, this is our, our mess to clean up, right.

Whether that was wrong or right, that's how he felt. And I remember one night I was. Um, couldn't sleep because I think we had fed our kids pancakes for like six days and I'm like, Heavenly Father, I don't know how to do this and how am I going to feed my family and, and please help us. And I couldn't really quite get the answer to this prayer that I was seeking and felt like my life had kind of fallen apart in some ways.

And I went out to the living room and I, I knelt down at the couch and everybody was sleeping. It was in the middle of the night and I started to pray. I mean, I love to pray, but I had never prayed this prayer. Like this prayer went into the night. Like it's the only thing that reminds me of Enos when I read the story of Enos.

And I prayed and prayed and prayed and I poured my heart out to God and I told him everything I felt and every concern and every worry and every care, and I just put it all out there and I prayed so long and I wasn't really receiving an answer. I just prayed. So long and that I was so tired. And so I remember I had a blanket wrapped around me and I pulled myself up on the couch and I laid there on the couch and looked up at the ceiling and I heard three words, I heard a voice that said, I've got you.

And it was, it was just, I was so unexpected. I did not expect. That to come. I mean, I, I know how to get answers to prayers, but it was so clear. And as I laid there, I just wept. I mean, I broke into, broke out into tears. I sobbed and I heard the words again, I've got you. And it, that moment was the moment that I realized that I mean, I know I'm not alone, right?

And I know that my Heavenly Father and that he hears my prayers, but it was the moment that I knew the savior had shown up for me, he showed up for me and it charted this course of kind of believing and understanding that. I don't have to do this life alone, right? It didn't change. Nothing changed. It took a lot of time for us to get back up on our feet, but it allowed me to find and follow the Savior in such a personal way.

And so then from there, we moved from Connecticut to Texas, to Seattle, to Australia, and then back to Connecticut. And now we're here in Utah. And, and in this moment, when you asked how this shape the culture of our family. We, you know, we lived in a place in Utah where, you know, 99. 9 percent of the people believed like we believed to a place in Eastern Connecticut where we were the only members of our faith in this town.

So my kids were the only members of their faith in their schools. In fact, people, I know we don't say Mormons anymore, but people didn't know. What you know, what being a member of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints was they hadn't even heard the term Mormon Which was a popular term, right?

and so we were found my kids found themselves in this place like You know It's kind of a wake up call for everybody and I had tried to prepare them and we had plans and we talked a lot But what this did is it united our family it we were super connected. We had each other we had to be all in kind of together and Our children experienced a lot of change and And then what was really amazing is we, we experienced a lot of diversity in backgrounds and religions and beliefs and cultures.

And we learned so much and we loved it. We met so many great people. And what, what it did for my kids is it became, they became adaptable. And resilient and we have friends all over the world, all over the United States and all over the world. I, I had a joke that I would say to heavenly father. I think he has a sense of humor.

I won't because I everywhere he put me, I would love it. You know, and then. And then something would happen and the spirit would tell us it was time to move again. And, and this felt like a curse to me. I'm like, this is not how I grew up. Why is this my life? How do I keep changing my children's lives? And, and I would make a joke that I'd have an angel would have to appear to me to get me to move.

And once we landed in Seattle, which we loved so much, we were thriving, our kids were thriving. And then we had this experience that told us we had to move. And this was what helped this kind of sent us to Australia. I made a joke and said, even if an angel comes, I'm not moving. I that's not, I know it's not funny, but, but it's how I felt.

Right. I was like, you can't, you, you would never expect me to move again. Right. But I learned to stop fighting God, like he wins anyway. So why fight him? Right. But, but. It became instead of a curse, it became the hugest blessing for me and my children to, I don't know, see other places and learn about other people.

And like I said, they became super adaptable and super resilient and it became these great adventures. And even in the difficulties, right? It's in the extremities that we meet God, right? Not in our comforts, even in some of these extremities and these difficulties, which are not the hardest things, but this was hard at the time.

We had the greatest blessings.

[00:08:21] Morgan Jones Pearson: That's awesome. Well, I have to say, I have learned firsthand that you do have friends everywhere and I admire that quality so much. We are going to talk today about, um, something that happened to your family a couple of years ago, almost to the day, which Tamara, when I reached out to you, I had no idea that it was two years ago this week.

But we're going to talk about your son Walker's passing. But before we get to that, the day before this accident happened, your daughter. was sealed. Is that right? Your daughter? Okay. And so you had all your family together. I wondered what in retrospect has it meant to you to have had this last chance for your family to all be together?

[00:09:11] Tamara McFadden: So we have, we have nine children. We have six biological and three bonus boys that in our travels, we've picked up along the way and never, they, they never left, you know, we feel so blessed about that. But so I have, you know, Hattie, my daughter that was married or sealed the day before Walker's passing.

She's one of my younger children. She's one of the twins. And so I've had, uh, you know, we have a bunch of kids and I've, I've done a bunch of weddings and. Like other weddings, it was a beautiful day. She said it was the perfect day, but retrospect, I mean, the thing is, is in the ceiling room, I, this is something I've thought about a few times, handful of times, but in that ceiling, I was sitting next to my daughter and my husband was kind of a cross sitting in the chair and, and they started, you know, the sealer was It's just awesome.

And just going through the whole moment and I was just loving it. And then something happened. It was like, I mean, I know what it's like to feel the spirit and I felt it quite often in my life. I, I thirst and hunger for that. It's something I, I have to have. And yeah. This warmth filled the room in a way, it was just a powerful moment.

And I felt like many people there. And I know that people will say that, especially when their children are getting zilled or, you know, cause in the temple anywhere, because it's where you're so close to heaven. And I feel that the veil can be so thin often in our lives. And it felt like that, but it was different, but I didn't know it until later.

And I can honestly tell you, looking back, I know that it was preparation, preparation for what was coming. And so, you know, we left the temple and, you know, some of my kids were in, um, in the ceiling with us and some are waiting outside and Walker was outside with bell. We have a daughter that has special needs. She has a severe seizure disorder, which is Hattie's twin. And he was out there with her and.

We took that last picture and that was looking back. Talk about retrospect, looking back at that picture that all of us together right in front of the temple. I mean, how beautiful is that to be able to not just take that picture, but to celebrate as a family and to tell you the truth. I didn't know how much I was going to appreciate that day.

Not until the next day. When we had the complete opposite experience, I mean, talk about contraries. I call it a pendulum swing going from this tear, this beautiful event the day before to this. I mean, complete joy and happiness, right? To the worst pain and sorrow I have ever felt in my life. Absolutely.

The hard thing is, is my sweet daughter, Hattie and her husband, you know, there was so much pain for them because we had to call them home from their honeymoon. It's been a long road of healing for, for Hattie. And I love that she's really honest about it. And I'm so proud of her, but it's been a really long road for her to figure out.

That, you know, why, like that question of why, why did that happen? I think that, you know, the questions of why did I get married the day before? Why does this loss have to be tied to that special day? That was hard for her as parents. I think we got there quicker than our daughter did. And we were able to kind of see those blessings and tie those events together.

But as you can imagine, it's taken some of my children some time to understand the why. What was really awesome though, Morgan, is, you know, this Tuesday, which marked the two year, I call it the two year homecoming that's Walker's homecoming. It helps me. I like that phrase better. We, my husband and I went and did sealings in the temple and it kind of took us full circle.

Does that make sense? . Or whole covenant that binds us together. And we walked in late in this, you know, sweet group of people were already doing sealings and, and. Before we. Um, participated, I stood up and I'm like, I just need to say something. I'm sure to see there was like, Oh no, what's happening.

But I said, I just want to share with you that this is the two year mark for us of our, our son's homecoming and we might cry a little bit and I just wanted everybody to be prepared because I know my husband and I would ugly cry. I didn't want to scare people, but these people. wept with us. We didn't even know them and they wept and they hugged us and they let us talk about Walker and it just kind of brought us full circle this binding covenant that links our family together forever.

[00:13:41] Morgan Jones Pearson: Well, I, I, to be honest, I hadn't really thought about what you said with your daughter and that would be so, so hard. So if you don't mind, Tell me a little bit about we we talked about the ceiling day the next day Walker was involved in a horrific accident that Your husband had to witness right in front of his face before we talk about what you experienced that day I'd love to have you tell us a little bit about Walker.

[00:14:12] Tamara McFadden: Okay, i'll try to keep this brief, but it's gonna be There's a lot to say but i'll i'll do my best but this is I thank you for asking me that When we did the sealings, that's what this either ask, tell us about your son. And I thought that was so sweet that he wanted to know about Walker. And so thank you for asking this question that just, yeah,

[00:14:31] Morgan Jones Pearson: I genuinely want to know.

[00:14:34] Tamara McFadden: So there's a, he is amazing. And I have to tell you, I have, you know, we are not. And everybody knows this. We are not a perfect family. We have our own issues, our struggles and frustrations and all the things. Right. But I have a, I have beautiful children, even, even as they're on their own journeys, trying to make it, which I honor people's journeys.

I'm a big believer in everybody having their journey. And I just feel really blessed to have the children that I had that really supported. We just, they supported me and. And my husband through this trial and they were there for us and almost like they let us mourn almost more than they did. And then we had to kind of flip it and remember that they were a part of it because they really stepped in.

And so I just have beautiful children. And so, as I share with you about my youngest, this was my youngest child. I just wanted to make sure that everyone knows that I love all of my children and feel so blessed. Um, when our third child Carter was born, I was holding this, um, these brand, this brand new baby, right?

He's, I've just had him and I'm holding him in my arms and I felt someone there. And I could feel this little boy and I couldn't see him. I just could feel this little spirit. He was happy, full of personality. And I could just feel like his excitement to come and be a part of our family. And I turned to my husband and I said, the next child's coming quickly.

Like I blurted it out. My husband's like, okay, I think you've had too much. What in the world are you talking about? I couldn't help how I felt. It was so powerful, so strong. And then six months later, we, We were expecting these surprise twins and I knew one was a boy. I knew it because I felt this little boy and as overwhelmed as I was with thinking, I'm going to have five kids under the age of six.

I don't know if I can handle this. I just knew I was going to finally get to meet this little boy. And then we had this ultrasound and we revealed that there was twin girls. And I'm like, wait, what? No, no, there's a boy. Cause I felt like I knew this little boy. And so I kind of had to work through those.

Those feelings because I thought, well, how did I get that wrong? I was preparing for a talk the next day to give in separate meeting. I was like seven months pregnant. And I, I had been preparing this talk all day and I was kind of overwhelmed and thinking about all the things I had to do. And I remember walking out of the office and I bent down to pick some toys or books off the floor.

And. I, as I stood up, I mean, you can call it what you want. You can call it a vision. I say spiritual eyes. This was more like this is the spiritual eyes. And, and it was as clear and real to me as if he was standing in front of me. And I saw this little blonde haired boy smiling with this really mischievous smile, which if you know Walker, you know exactly what I'm talking about.

In my mind, I heard the words, don't worry, mom, I'm coming. So years later, because we had this set of twins, one of our daughters is she has severe, a severe seizure disorder and she has special needs. And there was 5 years of really hard work trying to get her healthy. I finally decided we had this little boy.

I had to get him here. And when they handed Morgan, when they handed this baby to me. And I looked into his eyes. I knew him. I knew this little boy. That was the same little boy that was so anxious to be here. And so he was finally here. He was our baby. He was, there was a five year gap. He was our tailgater.

And what was so fun is that everybody went off to school and it was me and Walker for five years, right? Four or five years. By ourselves, just me and him, and he was busy and he was tenacious. He had no fear, but he was the light and the love and the laughter of our family. And one of my favorite memories of Walker is he loved life and he always had questions and every night it would tuck him in to bed and he would lay next to me.

So you could ask me questions like, and I'm not talking like simple questions. Like I'm talking deep spiritual questions. He wanted to know the answers to questions like, where did I, where did I live before I came to earth and what was it like there? And why can't I see heaven anymore? And what happens when we die?

And The one that was so funny to me is he would say, if Jesus loves me, why does Satan hate me? He had such a hard time understanding why anyone would hate him. He had, he just was like, I'm a lovable guy. He always said, I'm awesome. And so we had to constantly work through that one. That one made me laugh a lot.

Walker came to earth, like with these specific, with this specific personality and those that know him know exactly what I'm talking about. He knew who he was at all times. And don't get me wrong. He was a typical teenager, slightly inappropriate sometimes, but he was. He moved through life with confidence that was unlike anyone else, except for his father.

He reminded me a lot of his father. They were so similar in so many ways, but Walker was a gatherer. He was a natural leader. He, we moved so often. Like I mentioned, he was always the new kid, but within weeks we had a house full of tons of friends. I always knew Make sure your food is full. Your house is full of food and be ready for somber parties because he, he, everybody was at our house.

So he was happy. He was positive, he didn't worry about the small stuff and sometimes even the big stuff, which sometimes drove me crazy. But and then, like, sometimes I would counsel. I always try to counsel him when he'd leave the house, especially when he started driving and, um, I would. You know, just kind of prepare.

I'm like, what are you going to do when this happens? And what are you doing about this? And he would always grab my shoulders and look into my eyes and smile and say, mom, I got this. Don't worry. We had so many discussions about the importance of having a plan and being ready for things. And what are you going to do when this happens or that happens?

And he would always respond the same way. Almost every time I would say, mom, you have no idea how good of a kid I am. I can't be peer pressure. I know who I am. And this, it just made me smile. I mean, I know, like I said, he wasn't a perfect kid, but he was just so, he was so great. And everywhere we went, he was loved not just by kids, but by the adults.

I would always get their response. I love that kid. And I was always like, I know I love that kid too. He's loved fiercely. He was fiercely loved. We only lived in Utah for eight months coming from Connecticut and within that first weekend, our house was full of about 30 teenagers and it never changed. At his funeral, there were 1200 people in the stake center and over 2000 on zoom.

Um, he was a gatherer, he would gather everyone and after his passing, we received so many messages and letters, people would find us and share their story of Walker and their, their child and how he would gather them in, especially if they didn't belong or felt like they didn't belong, or they didn't quote unquote fit in, which is not true.

Everyone should fit, but Walker was, he had the ability to kind of see and notice and look and find after his passing, they received. So many messages and letters and, and I was amazed. I think they came in for so long. They still do. I still find people who know him and they share their story about him.

And you can't tell me just, just, I know this is my son and, and as much as I love the youth, you cannot tell me that the youth of today are not remarkable. President Nelson taught that the youth are unusually gifted in the gathering of Israel. I think I really believe that if we could see ourselves before we came to earth, if we See ourselves as who we really are.

If we could see our Children. And who they really are, it shouldn't surprise us, but I think we would be in awe. I'm in awe that one 16 year old boy could change so many lives in just the short time that he was here on earth. I know that the youth of today are foreordained to change the world.

[00:22:13] Morgan Jones Pearson: Well, I, I love that so much.

I appreciate you giving us a little taste of Walker. I always feel like there's been, there've been a few times. Um, a few times when I was at Deseret News, I wrote stories about people that had passed away. And then there have been times doing interviews for this podcast. And I always am like, Oh man, like I really want to meet that person.

And so I'm hoping that after this life, there will be a few select people that I will get to meet quickly. And Walker is now on that list. Tamara, you, can you tell me a little bit about the day of Walker's accident? You said that you received a call from your husband and that it was the kind of call that is something that you experience in a nightmare.

And I can only imagine, can you tell me a little bit about that call and how you responded immediately?

[00:23:11] Tamara McFadden: So obviously it was the day after the wedding and I was exhausted. I was so tired. And so I was laying in bed and I was on the phone with, I think my sister and, um, Walker had come in the room. So I've gotten off the phone and he was, uh, Had decided to go up and help my husband on the property.

We were building a home up here in Alpine and he was going to go help his dad on the property. And, and so he came in and he had gotten up late and it was like 10 in the morning and I was so tired and I was just laying in bed and he came in and we started chatting and we laughed about some things.

This is an interesting thing that I don't really tell very often, but we laughed about, we had just lost a dog to cancer and it was Walker's favorite dog. It was his dog. And we made a joke about, I said, Walker, don't you think you get to hang out with your animals there? Like, don't you think that you and Willis are going to just hang out all the time?

And he like, we started laughing. He started talking about Willis and we had talked about, that was just the thing I remember talking about. And then he turned around and right before he walked out the door, he turned around and he said, I love you, mom. And And then he left and, um, I didn't get up because I didn't, you know, I didn't know, right?

I, I, I had this terrible loop that was going in my mind over and over again. It took me about 3 or 4 months. Finally, that was healed. But why didn't I get up? You know, that regret? Oh, it was the worst. That was really hard for me. Um, but I didn't know, right? I He's just going to help like he leave and

[00:24:49] Morgan Jones Pearson: just another day.

[00:24:50] Tamara McFadden: Yes. Just another day. It's perfect. And then an hour later, my husband called and a, I will never forget his voice be. I will never forget my reaction. I had, I think, to tell you the truth, I think there were things that came out of my, like screaming and weight weeping that I didn't even know was inside of me.

I, I have a hard time going back there. Every once in a while I will, and then I quickly move off. Just like Rob can't go back to that video that plays in his head of what he saw. Mm-Hmm. . We try not to go back to that place and we actually. I've received some beautiful information that's helped us move away from that, but that's the nightmare, right, Morgan, that moment.

And I remember yelling in the phone. You're lying. You're lying. What was also really interesting is I couldn't cry. I think I was in shock and everybody kept saying, you're in shock. It took me an hour. To feel to start to feel that like the emotions come out of me. I was in, I had never felt that either, that kind of shock.

And I remember sitting on my, uh, my Bishop, our Bishop was the first one on the scene to help Rob and then Rob on the phone as he was calling me and the Bishop was next to him said, go be with Tamra. And so he came to the house and he sat with me and held me. And I could tell he was upset and I didn't, I just couldn't. Process it. It was really hard. And that was, that's not normal for me. I'm not, I've never experienced something like that. And I remember, um, probably an hour later sitting on the couch, my kids were all starting to come from where they were, our older children and the house was filling with people yet. I don't really remember everybody that was there, but I remember my mom and dad being there.

And I remember my mom sitting to my left and my dad to my right. And this is another thing I've not shared publicly. Um, we get to speak, um, at life after loss in a couple of weeks and I'm going to share it for the first time publicly there, but I, I think I'm going to share it. I, I remember grabbing my dad's neck and bringing him really close to my mouth, like his ear, right?

I wanted to whisper something in his ear. And I said, dad, how am I going to forgive my husband? How will I forgive him? Why, why did he not protect rocker? And I remember feeling that so it was came in so strong, right. And it scared me because I didn't know how to work through that, let alone the loss of my son.

And my dad looked me in the eyes and said, Tamara, we're going to take this a minute at a time. And as soon as I turned from my dad, I remember looking straight ahead and looking at my children and I felt the spirit say to me so clear, Morgan, the spirit said, say it. And I knew what the spirit was asking me to say without, without anything else, without any other communication in my head, I knew what I was being asked to say.

And I knew I had a choice to make at that moment. Cause I could go to really dark places. Like I could go to really bad places and I could take my husband with me. And, or I could make a different choice. And so I listened to that voice and it, it was, I don't even want to say it was hard. I just knew what I had to say.

And I looked up at my children and I said, I trust,

sorry, I trust my Heavenly Father. I trust my Savior. The next morning, I mean, Just to back up. I, I wanted to my, I wanted my children to say, hear me say it. Like I needed them to, I knew I needed them to, but Morgan, I needed to hear myself say it. And I wanted my only father to know that that's what I believed.

And when it's all said and done, that's, that's all I got. And the next morning I, I grabbed my scriptures. I knew that I needed to open them. I, I, that's where the, that's one of the only places I could find peace. And I, I remembered for some reason, the story of Mark four was in my head, you know, when the multitudes gathered on the edge of the sea and they're there to hear the Savior teach.

And so many people showed up, the savior climbs onto a boat and he teaches the people from as they sat on the seaside. And then he sends the multitude away and he and the disciples get on the, on the ship and they start to cross to their site. And then Mark four, It talks about how there are just this great storm comes, right?

Everybody knows the story. Most people know it. And the waves are beating onto the ship so much that it's, it's full, like the boat's full, and I love that. Just the imagery of that moment being out on the water and. It says, and he in verse 38, meaning Jesus was at the hinder part of the ship asleep on a pillow.

Now, I'm reading this story and I can just see it in my mind's eye. I could just see what's happening. And I know we've all had that same question. Like how, how is the Savior sleeping? In this massive storm and and why? Why is the Savior sleeping through this massive storm? And can he not hear the cries of his disciples?

And I could feel the fear almost like I'm on that boat with him. Does that make sense? Like, I feel like I'm on that boat and I am sinking and I can, I can almost like taste the fear and feel the fear and see the fear as the disciples are desperately trying to keep the boat from sinking all the while looking back at Jesus struggling with their own question.

Why? Why are you asleep? And then in verse 38, it says that they awake him and they say unto him, Master, carest thou not that we perish? And the Savior, it says he arose and he rebuked the wind and said unto the sea, peace, be still. And the wind ceased and there was a great calm. And then he says something so interesting to me.

He asked this question, why Why are you so fearful? How is it that you don't have any faith? And I thought, why is he asking that question? They're sinking. They're, they're in a storm. There's, they're afraid and you're asleep. How, why is that question even being asked? And I felt those fierce winds come into my life with, with a force that is indescribable.

Like waves crashing was such a force that I thought for sure I would drown. I felt pain like I'd never felt in my whole life in those first few days. I felt nothing but the deepest sorrow and the deepest grief. And I asked all those same questions. Why Heavenly Father? Why, why did you take my son? And I felt the heavens were totally close to me, like asleep at the hinder part of the ship.

I, I got that. I felt that. And people said, Oh, you're in shock. You're numb. You're grieving and all the reasons why I couldn't feel the spirit, but I needed peace and answers more now than at any other time in my life. And so I remembered the story and I got on my knees and I called out just like the disciples master, don't you care that I'm in a parish?

I could almost hear the savior say, Tamara, why are you so fearful? Where is your faith? Don't you believe me? Don't you trust me? Don't you know me? I will rise. I will rebuke the wind. I will say into the storms of your life, peace, be still, and the winds will cease. So why did the Savior ask that question?

Why are you so fearful? And what I learned is that it didn't matter. It didn't matter that there was a fear storm. It didn't matter that the wind was blowing and the waves were crashing. It didn't matter that the rain was falling and the boat was filling with water and they thought that they were going to drown because he was there.

And I was reminded of years ago, remember when I was laying on the couch calling out to God and I heard those words, I've got you. I love in verse 41 in Mark 4 when everything is still and quiet, like the contraries, right? I knew contraries. And the disciples in their amazement say to one another, what manner of man, man is this, that even the wind and the sea obey him.

And because the winds and the seas obey Jesus Christ, and I knew that, could he not heal my heart? Could he not heal a father's broken heart, a family grieving? Could he not heal and help us and bring peace in our own this own unique challenges and troubles. Can he not heal you in whatever struggle you're going through?

And this one decision alone at this crucial point, I believe was a hinge point for me and allowed me to see, to see and receive help from heaven and heaven showed up.

[00:33:26] Morgan Jones Pearson: I love the way that you tied that into that scripture. It's interesting to listen, because as you've talked about the way that the Spirit communicates to you, it's brought to mind several experiences that I've had, and it's interesting to me, like the, I've got you, I think sometimes it seems like the Spirit communicates in very short phrases that kind Come to your point, like come out of nowhere.

Um, and, and how, because they are short, you can remember them easily. Um, I recently had an experience where I was frustrated about something and I kind of was praying as I was making the bed and had the thought, like, why? Why isn't this working out? And very clearly in my mind, I heard, don't you trust me?

And so I love that that experience that you had years before allowed you to be able to handle something that I imagine was so much more painful and so much harder. Tamara, you mentioned that you're you and your husband have learned things that have allowed you to work through the grief that you, um, have experienced and I in talking to other people who have had the experience of losing a child, I have learned that.

I think one thing that can be tricky is that people tend to grieve a little bit differently. And so I wondered, how have you and your husband supported one another amidst a grief that I'm sure is a little bit different for each of you?

[00:35:05] Tamara McFadden: Well, yeah, this is a good one because remember I talked about how we're polar opposites in some ways, we totally grieved.

Polar oppositely. Is that a phrase? I don't even know, but I think it works. So Rob went busy. And he got super busy. He actually just poured himself into this house, building this house and, um, and this house became sacred ground, if that makes sense. And I'll explain more about a little bit later, but, um, and then I went still.

And I spent a lot of time studying and praying and reading and connecting. And I had to be still, I couldn't handle a lot of business and. Noise, noise was my enemy. I felt like he slept in Walker's room. He slept in his bed. He slept in, he slept, we slept in the same bed. The first night it happened. And the next night he said, I need to ask you something.

He said, would you, would it bother you if I slept in Walker's bed? I need that. And I said, you, I, yes, go. Like I, I knew he needed it and I was willing to give him everything he needed, considering what he, Experienced. He would go through all of Walker's things. I never went back down to his room in that rental house while we were building this house.

I never went to his room. Um, I know that's probably hard for people to hear. I just never wanted to go down there again. It was too painful for me. I only looked at two pictures until two days ago when we put all of his pictures out and I was so scared to do it, Morgan. I was like, I don't know if I can do this and I did it.

And I'm so proud of myself. And I know that. I received so much help from heaven, but, um, I only looked at two pictures for two years where my husband was like immersed in him. Does that make sense? Um, we agreed totally different. And it was hard for me because I, I sometimes felt guilt about that. Like, why am I, am I doing this right?

And how do you even know how to do it? And, and is there a right way? And Um, there were hard moments where we didn't see eye to eye and we had to like, you know, difficult moments where there were arguments and hey, you're not doing this like I think you should, and you're not showing up for me. And we had to really give each other grace and space to grieve in our own way.

And, and I received a gift from God, a woman in my ward that I did not know because we had just moved into the ward. She lost a son 15 years prior to me having my son pass away and she became a mentor and one of the things she always told me is there's not one right way to do this and you cannot rush grief.

So, do it exactly how it feels right to you. And so that's what Robin I did. He did it how it felt right to him and I did it how it felt right to me. But where we were similar again, is that individually. We looked to God and to his son and together they were our center. They were our constants. And that's what kept us connected and united when we didn't always understand how the other person was moving through the journey.

[00:38:13] Morgan Jones Pearson: You mentioned that you, um, were worried about your ability to forgive your husband. How were you able to work through that?

[00:38:23] Tamara McFadden: That moment, Morgan, when I looked up to my kids. And the spirit said, you have a choice to make saying that phrase. I trust my Heavenly Father took every bit, every ounce of anything out of me.

And I have never once, nor would I ever blame my husband for my son's death. Ever, never. Um, that is, my husband loved his son and I know that, and I could never do that to him, especially considering what he experienced. Um, and we were given incredible blessings that opened up the way to help us understand why Walker was taken in that way at that time.

And it healed that. That's part of the healing. So I just let it go. It just, it left me because I believe it's because I was willing to. I mean, just like, just like the Savior on the boat, right? Don't you trust me? Like you said, when you were making that bed, don't you trust me? And as soon as I trusted him, I gave it to him, let him carry it.

That storm was gone. That, that part of that storm was gone. There were still other parts of the storm. Don't get me wrong, but that part was gone, totally gone and taken.

[00:39:43] Morgan Jones Pearson: That's amazing. I believe it 100%, but it still is amazing to me the way that the Lord can take things from us, um, take our burdens. Um, another thing that I wondered about is shortly after the accident, over 500 people in your community came to your home despite pouring rain and saying the song, Peace in Christ.

And I watched that video and it is. So moving. Um, I wondered what have you learned about others abilities to uphold us when, like that song says, when we feel like we can't go on?

[00:40:20] Tamara McFadden: Well, let me give you a little background on, on that. The importance of that song in particular being sung by that group of people.

This song or that, that moment or that Event of all those people in the community is showing up was the perfect example of heaven showing up. I believe that I believe that the world is heavily influenced by the other side of the bell without taking away our agency because agency is a precious gift from God, right?

He loves agency, but I do believe that there is, I just believe we're heavily influenced and help comes from both sides of the bell, heavenly angels and earthly angels. And yeah. Like I said, for 24 hours, um, I struggled to feel the spirit to fill my son. This was, that was as painful as the loss of my son, not feeling the spirit or feeling my son was just as painful.

Um, and I needed to feel the spirit more than ever. I was standing in my bedroom. And this thought came to my mind, turn on some music. Like, and as soon as it, as soon as I heard that phrase, I'm like, duh. Yes. Cause you know, music is, it brings the spirit faster than any, even the spoken word, right? Music does something to you.

And so the first song that I turned on a playlist or I don't even know what I turned on, but I turned on Spotify or something. And the first song that came on was peace in Christ. And I was taken back to my time or our time in Australia when I was called to be the stake young woman's president. And I served with, you know, all these youth that I love so much, all these Polynesian kids and Australian kids.

And one of the years are, you know, the theme was peace in Christ and it was just an awesome year. I loved that thing. But when I left to go to come home, the Polynesian kids did the Haka for us and they sang peace in Christ. And so that song. meant something to me already. Does that make sense? Like it was, it was, it was just important to me.

That song was so important to me. And, and when I turned on that song, I just, I felt for the first time, the way that I needed the spirit to come back into my life and not that. Whether that was, you know, it was probably obviously on me that I wasn't filming, but I don't know, whatever it was, it just came in like a rush and, um, it was so familiar.

I thought, okay, I can do this. I'm home. I'm home. And moments later, um, I felt my son and I had a sacred, beautiful moment. In that moment. And then within, I think it was later that night, an army of earthly angels, like you said, 500 people, men, women, and children, they showed up and they stood outside in the rain and they say, and I just, it's incredible, right?

That they would stand out there and be there and sing that song. And they had no idea how important that song was to me. Into my family. It's amazing. And I can't even. adequately tell everybody how grateful we are that people showed up. And that's the phrase that I use. I learned a lesson when you say, what have I learned about others abilities to uphold us when we feel like we can't go on?

I learned the importance of showing up and people showed up, people we didn't even know. I showed up for us and like letters and food and gifts and Just they would send us messages. Someone wrote our name or put our name on the prayer roll of every working temple and wrote down every working temple and gave it to us.

And this is the messages and the outpouring of love. I take that scripture in 3rd Nephi 27, 27, when very seriously, when the Savior says, what manner of men are you to be, be like me? And, you know, we, we all, all of us that are a part of our faith, we take that sacrament every Sunday and we promise that we're like, I'm going to, I'm going to think like you walk, like you talk, like you love, like you want to be just like you.

And that's what I felt that all of those people. took that. I mean, it's covenant, right? It's a promise. It is more than a promise. It's a covenant. They took that really seriously. And I saw the savior in 500 people standing outside my house. And that was powerful for me. And that was so healing for our family.

[00:44:44] Morgan Jones Pearson: I always love hearing the, the many, many different ways that people are able to mourn with those that mourn. And this example was particularly touching to me. Another thing I wanted to ask you about, Tamara, before we get to our last question, you said in another interview that I watched that you have learned more about your son since he passed than you'd known about him in his nearly 17 years on earth prior.

What did you mean by that?

[00:45:15] Tamara McFadden: Well, if you would allow me, I'm going to share something very sacred, but I have prayed to know if this is something I can share. And, and I have been told that I can, and I, and it's sacred, but it's not a secret. It's so beautiful, Morgan. And. This is really what healed me in the biggest way.

When our Bishop came down and was on the property with my husband and saw what he saw and experienced what he experienced. One night he went back to his office and he knelt down on his knees and he said, I don't know how to carry this with this family. You've got to help me because I don't know what to do.

He was a brand new Bishop, just barely called. And he came into my bedroom. A day after Walker passed, and I was, you know, obviously remember I was struggling, feeling the spirit, struggling with everything. And he described a revelation that he had. He's talked about it being a vision. He said that he received this revelation about how to help our family, but the most healing answer to our questions.

Was when the bishop shared that the savior himself was there on the day of the accident and that he came and he took our son. And I believe this Morgan. Like when he told me, I was like, I believe I, I believe this, but I needed to know for myself. This sent me on a path to ask for three miracles. And I won't describe those in today, but one of the miracles I asked for was to be able to.

Know that for myself. I wanted to receive my own revelation, my own personal revelation of this. I had to know it for myself. I wanted to know, and I knew I could ask for it. And I knew that God would answer this prayer. And I prepared to receive a priesthood blessing from my husband. And in that blessing, I learned more about my son.

And that's what I describe. I learned more about my son and who he is and what he's doing than I knew in his 16 years of his life. And I would. I want to share with you just something. This is the sacred part of this blessing. I wanted to share that I believe is so universal that yes, this is about my son, but I believe it with all that I am that it's about all of us.

And this is just a small portion that gave me a great amount of peace and my husband. It said the Savior stood with your son and waited on the other side of the veil for the actions that led to him crossing over. He stood patiently waiting and in the moment the time was right, he lovingly embraced your son.

The Savior was not alone. He was not alone in that moment. There were many other family members that were there and the reunion was immediately. I bless you to know that his heart is with you and he felt nothing in his passing, which was really significant. So remember, I asked for three miracles. When Walker passed away, this wasn't the first miracle I asked for, and it was granted to me.

We read all the time, right? Morgan, we read all the time, these scriptures about, and we're taught by our prophets, our living prophets, stories and miracles found in our scriptures and, and in words that we hear at conference. So, we stories about how Jesus Christ came to help to heal and to lift. We, we read about how he healed a man plagued with an illness for 38 years at the pool of Bethesda, a woman who made her way through a crowded city, just to touch his robe and be healed a man who had, um.

With palsy that was lowered down for a roof to get near the savior. Uh, he went out of his way for the widow of name to raise her only son from the dead, the woman at the well, Mary, Martha, Lazarus, he came for a 14 year old boy who had questions who knelt in a grove of trees to get answers to those questions.

I could go on and on, but there are countless stories where Jesus Christ came for so many people, but so often we don't count ourselves as part of those stories. He came if he came for so many people, not just during his mortal ministry, but before and after. And now, and now you can add Walker to that list.

The Savior came from my son and the Savior has come for me again and again and I testify I know it with everything that I am. This isn't a belief. This is something that I know that he will come for you too. And I love this scripture in John 14, 18 through 19 when he says, I will not leave you comfortless.

I will come to you. He says the word, I, and he's, yes, he's speaking to his disciples when he's getting ready to leave. Right. And he's going to be crucified. And, and, and then he goes on to say, he had a little while the world. See if me no more, but you see me because I live. He shall live. Also. He says, I will come to you.

He will come. This is his promise. And because elder Bednar puts it perfectly because he's a personal savior. And I learned in that moment to not look at my son the same way. I also didn't want to, I didn't want to move past Walker where he stayed 16 and we all moved past. And so another prayer that I've prayed that has been really interesting is I've prayed every day.

Let me know my son. Let me continue to know my son and Heavenly Father in his goodness allows me to continue to learn more and know my son and have a relationship with him because I believe Walker is alive today more than ever.

[00:50:26] Morgan Jones Pearson: That is absolutely beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing all of that. Um, Tamara, it has been such a gift to be able to learn from you and to feel of your testimony.

And your trust in Heavenly Father. My last question for you is what does it mean to you to be all in the gospel of Jesus Christ?

[00:50:48] Tamara McFadden: I love this question. I love it. I love that you ended that question. You know, I thought I knew Jesus Christ. I have taught and testified of him my entire life, but I can tell you that today I know him differently.

And I am changed because of him. Jesus Christ has carried this burden, this terrible, inexpressible pain, grief, and sorrow. I thought, I literally thought I would never function again. Just breathing felt impossible. I would never smile or laugh or how would I ever survive this? I didn't want to survive this.

And sometimes in the beginning, and I was like, I don't even want to be on this earth anymore. I want all my family together. This isn't working for me, but I can see and I've seen. The savior in the garden suffering for me. And I know that he suffered for all of us and all of it, everything. And my mortal brain cannot comprehend this because just this one insurmountable trial almost buried me and he suffered it for me.

He suffered that pain for me. And I am amazed he has taken the pain and the sorrow and the grief and comforted me and lifted me. And he is healing me. I everything to the savior. I love the quote by Patrick, um, elder Patrick Kieran, when he says, Jesus specializes in the seemingly impossible, he came here to make the impossible possible.

The irredeemable redeemable to heal the unhealable, to write the unrightable, to promise the unmissable. And he's really good at it. In fact, he's perfect at it. And one of the things I love to say is I am a living witness of this. Like Morgan, I am a walking miracle. I'm living proof that the atonement of Jesus Christ is real and it works and it's living, living and breathing.

It's a powerful gift from our heavenly parents and their loving son and president Nelson, the prophet of God said that we live to die and we die to live Jesus Christ too. Was born to die and he died to live. And because of him, because of Jesus Christ and that incredible gift of his atonement, the indescribable suffering on the cross and his glorious resurrection, Walker lives and I will live and you will live and all of those that you love will live because of him.

We will all live. And like I said before, this isn't a wish. It's not a hope. It's not a desire. It's not even a belief for me at this point. This is truth. I know it. I know he lives. I know Walker is alive more today than ever. I feel it. I can't wait to see him again and hug him. I can't wait to stand. No, I can't wait to kneel in the presence of my savior and bathe his feet with my tears.

I'm all in because Jesus Christ was all in and I owe everything to him.

[00:53:32] Morgan Jones Pearson: Thank you so much, Tamara. As you were talking, I was thinking about how your witness is so powerful, especially as we celebrate Easter this month and Thinking about how Mary was the first witness of Christ at the tomb, but far from the last witness of him, and you are a witness of him, and I appreciate you being that.

I appreciate your example of, Working with the Savior to overcome something unbelievably hard and I appreciate you sharing that with us. Thank you so, so much.

[00:54:11] Tamara McFadden: Thank you for letting me share means a lot to me.

[00:54:18] Morgan Jones Pearson: We are so grateful to Tamara McFadden for joining us on today's episode. It is my hope that her witness of the truthfulness of the Easter story will strengthen your own and that we can all prepare our hearts for this sacred holiday. Thanks to Derek Campbell for his help with this episode. And that's it for this episode.

And thank you for listening. We'll look forward to being with you again next week.